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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 4, 2013 17:07:56 GMT -5
If you don't mind a good old debate and wont get upset I say GO FOR IT!!! I'm all for a good healthy debate. I'm actually one of the few on here who don't hate Stefan. I actually like the guy when he's not talking about Damon or pertaining to Elena. I love his scenes with Klaus, Bekah, Bonnie and especially Caroline. I even sometimes enjoy the brothers. Stefan is not my least favorite person on the show. I think the reason he can ruffle my feathers so easily is because I do care somewhat about him. But anyway you know where I stand in this debate so I don't need to discuss any further. LOL No guilt.... I hope to God she feels bad and or sorry for the pain she is causing Stefan but not guilty. She made her bed she should be confident and sleep in it. Guilt is more of a sympathy kind of emotion. Stefan doesn't need sympathy. He is not pathetic. He needs empathy. He needs people to understand what he is going through and be there for him. Not sit there and pitty him. Guilt to me is just that. Guilt shows no real emotion toward Stefan. but Guilty and feeling sorry is kind of the same but also different. If she felt sorry for him wouldn't that be more pathetic and for her to pity him/. i rather have her feel guilty to an extent. I don't want her out of guilt to go back with Stefan either I just think she should feel some type of guilt and lil hurt for hurting him Nope Guilt means she felt like she did something wrong. She didn't do anything wrong. What she did was hurt Stefan and she can feel sorry that she hurt him. Sorry could mean that she wishes he never would have gotten hurt by what she did but guilt to me is she is not feeling sorry that he is hurt she just feels guilty for his pain which she shouldn't because there is nothing to feel guilty about. IMO she did what her heart told her to and I don't feel Damon nor Elena should feel guilty but they can tell Stefan "hey we are happy that we did this, we love each other but what sucks is that it hurt you and we are sorry that in what we did to be happy hurt you and for that we feel sorry for causing you pain." To me feeling guilty isn't correct because again I don't feel you should guilty when it comes to love or being with someone you want to be with. If you choose that road walk down it without regret and with confidence. You can feel sad that others are hurt by your actions but they are your actions that you made so don't feel guilt over them. People feel guilty all the time. Doesn't mean they feel sorry for causing that person pain by their actions. Just IMO.... I'm not saying Stefan doesn't deserve anything... I'm just saying I don't like guilt is all. So I'm not dissing Stefan or not giving him what I think he deserves.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 17:18:06 GMT -5
Well I think she should feel guilty and sorry for what they did.... because she and damon did do things wrong. It is not that they wanted to be together it not solely because they sex, but because of how they handled it afterward and that they were careless and Damon would not want to be treated that way if the situation was switched and neither would Elena so yes they should feel sorry for him and feel guilt because they caused it and they did have to make it as bad for him as they did. It was going to hurt no matter what BUT the way it went down was WAY more hurtful than it needed to be.
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 4, 2013 17:31:10 GMT -5
Totally in your opinion!!!
He waited one day after he told Stefan he would break the bond and honestly he didn't even have to break the bond for Stefan. The bond has nothing to do with him. Damon and Elena are in the relationship and Damon owed himself and Elena to break the bond. He waited one day to do it and within that day sent her away. They just had sex. Of course he wasn't going to tell him in New Orleans. how tacky would that be with the whole bond thing hanging over their head.
We are acting like it was a week, a month and even a year of secret betrayal behind Stefan's back. They weren't gonna give the guy a courtesy call before they had sex. Stefan finds out in the next episode. The sex JUST HAPPENED! They JUST got together. Can they swallow everything that happened and try to understand it before they break down Stefan's world?
I just think it's unrealistic to think that the very next day after they had sex they owe Stefan an explanation. Can't they figure out what it is they are doing before they tell Stefan?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 17:36:06 GMT -5
Well Elena seemed to find the time to tell two people in that one day and yes Damon should have told Stefan because they were bonding. The only reason he didn't was not because it would crush him but because of the sire bond information (imo) he already felt a little guilty
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 4, 2013 17:39:08 GMT -5
I think its going to be more about the fact they even did anything so quick rather then them telling him what they did. I don't think Stefan was thinking that they were gonna jump on w.e feelings they had so quick so i think thats where the betrayal will be.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 17:42:40 GMT -5
Yes, it will be that, but all I am saying is that it hardens the blow when he hears it from someone else. When he was made a fool. That everyone knows she went straight into Damons arms and he was left clueless. It makes it worse.
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 4, 2013 17:59:40 GMT -5
Well Caroline had no right to tell! She should have kept her mouth shut! And the only reason Elena told those two people or found the time to tell them was because Caroline was dissing Damon and well she just slept with him and she has strong feelings for him. I don't think it was her intention to even tell them and had she known CARE would have ran TWICE to Stefan and opened her mouth I'm sure she would have never told her so that she could have been the one to tell Stefan.
Look guys I get it... It sucks. It's your ship and you don't want to see Stefan hurt. I get that. You think the sex was too early and that them having sex now is going to be some big betrayal.
I get it. I just don't agree with you. I've waited 3 and a half seasons for DE and although yes the sex was a surprise for even me I get why it happened. Hell i would have joined them in the sex if I was there in that house because of the bursting emotions I've held in for 3 and a half seasons! Imagine what was going on in them as vampires when their emotions are heightened and everything is magnified. Especially if you suppressed those feelings for sooooo long.
I don't think you guys will ever let Elena off the hook because she hurt Stefan. But put yourself in her shoes and try to relate to her and maybe you might still think she shouldn't have but you can understand HOW it could happen.
At the end of the day the two of them were both single. Stefan can feel hurt but they have every RIGHT in the world to do as they please. We have to give them at least that. Elena was not with Stefan anymore.... Stefan broke up with her and well Damon has been wanting Elena and Stefan has known this for the longest. In reality they both have waited a long time to be together. Stefan and Elena hooked up maybe two weeks after knowing each other.
AND Damon didn't tell Stefan about the sex because he had more pressing issues like his WHOLE WORLD FALLING APART! The woman he loves and finally has was SIRED to him. I'm sorry while bonding on the trip he didn't ruin it with that info. It wasn't the time nor place.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 18:06:50 GMT -5
I am not mad at Elena I mean I do think the sire bond played a part in them doing the deed so early. I am frustrated that Damon did not want to tell Stefan and you're right Caroline did not make it easy on Elena ( I kinda conveniently forgot about that haha thanks for calling me out ha!) but it was bad planning to not say anything when they would be spending the whole day without each other and Damon would be spending the whole day with Stefan. Granted the maybe have never heard about what expression was because I think Stefan would have gone crazy, but I think he would have been happier in the long run that Damon told him. Not in the moment, but over time.
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 4, 2013 18:25:12 GMT -5
Yes but Damon didn't want to tell him then. not while the bond was an issue. Not while Stefan was already down his back about the bond. Do you remember how snarky and annoying Stefan was being toward Damon. he was already pissed about Elena. I mean Stefan even apologized! It just wasn't the time to do it. Let them resolve the bond issue. one issue at a time. Seriously no one knew Care would ruin it.
I said one thing about all of this... Elena and Damon had a right to tell Stefan themselves when the time was right. I said it before Care even opened her big mouth. It wasn't fair that Stefan found out that way but it wasn't their fault and I'm sure they didn't want him to know that way either. It all sucks for Stefan and DE that Caroline was being big mouth.
She took the one thing that DE had the right to tell Stefan! But as soon as Elena told Care I said that because I knew she would tell Stefan.
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 4, 2013 18:31:30 GMT -5
Yes but Damon didn't want to tell him then. not while the bond was an issue. Not while Stefan was already down his back about the bond. Do you remember how snarky and annoying Stefan was being toward Damon. he was already pissed about Elena. I mean Stefan even apologized! It just wasn't the time to do it. Let them resolve the bond issue. one issue at a time. Seriously no one knew Care would ruin it. I said one thing about all of this... Elena and Damon had a right to tell Stefan themselves when the time was right. I said it before Care even opened her big mouth. It wasn't fair that Stefan found out that way but it wasn't their fault and I'm sure they didn't want him to know that way either. It all sucks for Stefan and DE that Caroline was being big mouth. She took the one thing that DE had the right to tell Stefan! But as soon as Elena told Care I said that because I knew she would tell Stefan. I agree and I know I was upset that Caroline went and kind of confirmed they were together. I guess she just got caught up in the moment where Stefan was talking about trust and family etc etc Either way lets face it stefan was going to feel betrayed. Right from them having sex fifty million times. lol
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Post by Slash on Jan 4, 2013 20:08:05 GMT -5
Can we all agree on one thing at least?: Caroline is a horrible, horrible character/person/friend these past few episodes with the way she's been acting. Not just to Elena with this 'fixing' crap, railing Damon who she knows Elena has feelings for, the absurd Stefan cheerleading and what not but the way she's piling more crap on top of Stefan when he's feeling bad enough about Elena being a Vampire. Caroline is throwing more 'Elena' problems at him after he just broke up with her when he doesn't need it and is trying to focus on the 'cure' and looking into the 'sire bond' on top of that. Then you have what she did to Tyler's friend and thinking less of his 'pack' at that point in time because they weren't friends of hers that they were worth sacrificing.
She's the lead contender for worst character of the season IMO. She's been nothing but a problem.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2013 21:16:58 GMT -5
I have not been a big fan of Caroline since she broke up with Matt. It is who she is though. She has always knda been this way.
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Post by Slash on Jan 4, 2013 23:53:24 GMT -5
Matt broke up with her, right? After he found out she was a Vampire and had to kind of get some time to think about everything? By that time, she was already fully on with Tyler. I just don't like that she's pointing this finger at Elena at times about the Brothers and even slamming Damon for sleeping around (when he wasn't with Elena) when she's getting around herself. I liked her with Tyler early on (S2) but from S3 and on, she's gone from my favorite to probably my most hated character on the show. She just seems so different to me now compared to before. She was perfect in S2 and I liked her development, along with Tyler's but now I just can't stand the 2 honestly. Also hate how she's considered the poster child of a 'good' Vampire. Has a handle on everything and people now come to her for advice on adapting/being a Vampire (along with being able to take on anyone she's been up against in a fight/confrontation such as the Tomb Vampires but Hayley sure showed her ). Ultimately within this triangle though, I hope Elena gets neither Brother. I hope they decide that this just isn't worth it (an eternity of this bulls***) and that Elena being a friend that has shown them so much in the past year+ is a worthwhile life experience to take away from the whole ordeal. They still remain in MF and protect Elena & Co. from the standpoint of a 'friend' should the need arise but other than that, they're done with her and do a bit of traveling to find someone that isn't a doppelganger/looks like the exact same girl that has strained their relationship so much for the past century and a half. If both Brothers left MF for a few months/a year and returned each with a lady on their arm without all this crap they've through to get with Elena, maybe that'd be a step in the right direction and to being happy. Elena will have hit college at that point and can find someone there. I just want to see some solid, stable couples but that's too much to ask. Jeremy & Bonnie, Damon + whoever, Stefan + whoever, Caroline & Tyler, Matt & Bekah(/April?), Elena + whoever. The Brothers come back to town and host a dinner party and are just happy to see each other and everyone after a year and to catch up/move back. Since it's the college years and everyone is in a stable relationship, it'd be like an entirely new show. Focus more on the town/mythology with the triangle out of the way. Meh. I just made myself sad
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 5, 2013 3:11:24 GMT -5
I don't mind the triangle... I mean when I signed up to watch the show I knew the premise of it. I knew it was about a girl who was stuck between two vampires who happened to be brothers. I guess I just knew I'd have to choose one and go with it. Well I chose Stefan and then Friday Night Bites aired and I jumped ship and have been committed to DE ever since.
I could never imagine the triangle ending for good until the very end. I've been through much worse triangle shows that really hurt me... (I know it's a TV show but hey you get invested)!!! This one hasn't even got nasty yet. I mean Damon and Elena haven't even had a chance at a real relationship. Once they do then it can be a triangle. Right now it's a funky almost triangle with uneven edges.
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Post by Slash on Jan 5, 2013 4:03:22 GMT -5
I came into the show on a whim/not knowing anything about the background other than 'Vampires and Supernatural'. I think it was when Nikita was scheduled after TVD and there were times when I had nothing on during the 8pm slot so I'd just switch to TVD and turn the volume down while I waited for Nikita to come on. One night, I decided to actually watch an episode (the one where Caroline was in the hospital and Damon offered up his blood) and got interested. That was really my first go with the show. Before that, I had the 'Twilight' impression of it and avoided it on that alone. Just not a fan of triangles so far or shows that bill having one really don't or I hate the lead female character and don't get all the interest in her. True Blood, I hate Sookie so I don't see the fascination by characters like Eric & Alcide in wanting her. TVD, Elena annoys me to a point so I don't see why go through all the trouble and it's been a relationship of SE with Damon looking in/making himself noticed. Twilight as mentioned was one of those 'Team' things when Jacob didn't have a chance in any realm of Hell so I don't get that at all and it's for Bella at that Lost Girl has a 'triangle' sort of with Bo being a succubus and having feelings for Dyson (a Werewolf) and Lauren (a human) but it's really not the focal point and she does have stints with both of them (and they have their own relationships outside of Bo) so it's done in a 'enjoyable' manner for me cause they're not all hung up/rooted to each other/the triangle. So I guess I enjoy the 'triangle' when it's less so one. I don't like the approach of someone being in a relationship and then trying out someone else or someone else trying to push their way in in a heavy handed manner (the way TVD is doing it). If Elena was single and never became official with Stefan before Damon was really in the picture, I'd enjoy seeing both trying to win her over and her having her moments with both in a non-BF/GF way. But as it's been, I've hated it. Elena trying to 'choose' when she was with Stefan, Stefan laying out all his Brother's history to get people to already have a negative opinion of him (some still can't see the good in him) and Damon trying his damnedest to get Elena while trying to respect his Brother at times (odd as hell). Most of the synopsis I've read for books I've been looking into seem to have the lead female having a new interest every few books or so and that's something I'm fine with instead of being hung up on the same guys all the way through the series (for some of the longer running ones). If they're regulated to a supporting 'main character' role for a few books while the lead explores others before settling on the earlier ones, that even works for me. This or the LG approach for Elena/TVD probably would have been better for a long running show. Buffy did something similar, no? I just think they can go stretches without this triangle stuff and just focus on 'life' (these people are in High School, on their way to college) or whatever the current problem is. That or just give the couples believable problems that can break them up that isn't dependent on some triangle mess (like the main trio or what was going on with Jeremy, Bonnie and Anna).
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