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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 16:45:54 GMT -5
I started this thread to not cause any drama in the Ship threads. But I wanted to respond to this freely =)
Proxi didn't mind but I will post it in my own words…..
Basically saying Stefan shouldn't take Elena back if he has any bit of respect left and why do Stelena fans have any desire of wanting them back if Elena slept with his brother. etc etc
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 16:53:14 GMT -5
With the Triangle being the center of the show I highly doubt they will end S/E right now.
I am one fan that Im pretty okay with taking opinions from both Ships.
I also said that Elena crossing that line With Damon (Her sleeping with him) was going to be a step too far for Stefan and if they ever have Elena go back with Stefan they were going to have to build them back up for it.
IMO: Elena was out of character by jumping into bed with Damon SO SOON. Not saying that she doesn't have feelings for him because I know she does but because stefan had just ended it with her.
So Do I see Stefan taking Elena back right Now? NO but eventually I can see it happening.
Your argument about it was how Can A guy take back a girl who slept with his brother. If we going to go by that how can Damon sleep with a girl who was just his brother's girlfriend 24 hours earlier?
How can Damon kiss her while she was still with Stefan (When it was actually Katherine)
How Can Damon actually say he tried to win her fair and square when Stefan was stuck on Ripper Mode and under compulsion with no humanity….
Damon was willing to go after Elena through all that knowing Elena was his brother's girl first and his love for her over powered w.e type of boundaries he should've had..
So Why judge Stefan if he does decide to take elena back?
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proxi
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Post by proxi on Jan 14, 2013 17:19:40 GMT -5
No problem!
To answer your arguments...
Ya, I have my own issues with Elena sleeping with Damon. My thought is that it was a rushed decision and a basis for many of the argues between the ships. And it puts a shadow on Elena's character, despite the direction of the triangle. And this goes both ways, it tainted the Salvatore brothers relationship. I prefer to take it as a misplaced long-waited decision:)
About Stefan's ripper mode... it kind of ended in 3x08-3x09 so... when Damon admitted in 3x15 that he tried to win Elena, I don't remember seeing a nervous Stefan. Actually, I guess he was secretly happy that Damon did the ugly job.
And I haven't seen him arguing with Damon in 3x21 about what would they do if the other one gets the girl. I guess it was a mutual understanding that any of them could be chosen.
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proxi
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Post by proxi on Jan 14, 2013 17:22:46 GMT -5
I started this thread to not cause any drama in the Ship threads. But I wanted to respond to this freely =) (Proxi I hope you don't mind me copying and pasting this here) <snip>
Do not pull someone's post out of a shipper thread and repost it somewhere else. If you want to give the general gist of what you are objecting to, without specifics, fine, but do not pull posts out of a shipper thread to use somewhere else unless you have express permission from that poster.
Please rephrase your debate in your own words...
DoppelgangerI don't see why Ruby can't use my post... But, again, I'm not sure I know the rules:) If she needs my permission, she has it:) |
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 17:26:36 GMT -5
I started this thread to not cause any drama in the Ship threads. But I wanted to respond to this freely =) (Proxi I hope you don't mind me copying and pasting this here) <snip>
Do not pull someone's post out of a shipper thread and repost it somewhere else. If you want to give the general gist of what you are objecting to, without specifics, fine, but do not pull posts out of a shipper thread to use somewhere else unless you have express permission from that poster.
Please rephrase your debate in your own words...
DoppelgangerI don't see why Ruby can't use my post... But, again, I'm not sure I know the rules:) If she needs my permission, she has it:) Its ok Proxi if you want you can copy and paste your own original post here so people can see what its about =) |
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 17:33:02 GMT -5
No problem! To answer your arguments... Ya, I have my own issues with Elena sleeping with Damon. My thought is that it was a rushed decision and a basis for many of the argues between the ships. And it puts a shadow on Elena's character, despite the direction of the triangle. And this goes both ways, it tainted the Salvatore brothers relationship. I prefer to take it as a misplaced long-waited decision:) About Stefan's ripper mode... it kind of ended in 3x08-3x09 so... when Damon admitted in 3x15 that he tried to win Elena, I don't remember seeing a nervous Stefan. Actually, I guess he was secretly happy that Damon did the ugly job. And I haven't seen him arguing with Damon in 3x21 about what would they do if the other one gets the girl. I guess it was a mutual understanding that any of them could be chosen. I agree about it being rushed but then again I really feel she acted on compressed emotions she was even dealing with while being human. Also when Damon said the comment about trying to win her fair and square it was when he thought Stefan had sabotaged their plan to kill Klaus. When in fact stefan messed up the plan because if they went through with it the Hybrids were ordered to kill Damon. So he thought he could win her fair and square after he pulled that move but the next day when he found out about Stefan saving him thats why he was pissed about it. And I guess that whole conversation about the other leaving town was with her choosing and her initial choice was Stefan. and Stefan didn't even want Damon to live up to him actually leaving so i don't know what will happen now with that. Maybe Stefan will wait until the sire bond is broken or Elena becomes human to see what her choice will be |
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proxi
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Post by proxi on Jan 14, 2013 17:41:05 GMT -5
No, the comment was in 3x15 after they turned Bonnie's mom, and the discussion about Stefan sabotaging the plan with Klaus was in 3x10 (remember, Damon feeling guilty for kissing Elena, knowing that Stefan has the coffins?)
Anyway, the stupid bond HAS TO disappear because it is getting on my nerves... None of the characters acts normal because of it. None!!! Stefan is in his quest to "fix" Elena (gross), Elena is sired, Damon is the sire, so (on a quick view) no free agency here, Klaus is "the ally"... should I go on?...
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 17:42:55 GMT -5
I could've sworn Damon said that comment right before he kissed Elena. He said he didn't want to feel guilty about trying to win her fair and square and then said if I'm going to feel guilty i might as well feel guilty about this and BAM kissed her lol
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Post by Doppelgänger on Jan 14, 2013 17:48:19 GMT -5
I started this thread to not cause any drama in the Ship threads. But I wanted to respond to this freely =) (Proxi I hope you don't mind me copying and pasting this here) <snip>
Do not pull someone's post out of a shipper thread and repost it somewhere else. If you want to give the general gist of what you are objecting to, without specifics, fine, but do not pull posts out of a shipper thread to use somewhere else unless you have express permission from that poster.
Please rephrase your debate in your own words...
DoppelgangerI don't see why Ruby can't use my post... But, again, I'm not sure I know the rules:) If she needs my permission, she has it:) I looked at it from my own point of view that *I* would not want my posts that I posted in my fellow shippers thread pulled out and reposted somewhere else on the site than where I intended it to be posted. So, to avoid that possibility of upsetting fellow posters, I don't want to see it happening. It's easy enough to paraphrase or put into one's own words for a debate thread. Thanks |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Jan 14, 2013 18:01:45 GMT -5
I could've sworn Damon said that comment right before he kissed Elena. He said he didn't want to feel guilty about trying to win her fair and square and then said if I'm going to feel guilty i might as well feel guilty about this and BAM kissed her lol The fair and square comment was made to Stefan during the conversation about having killed Bonnie's Mom...but just to make sure I looked it up: I personally do not think it was too soon for Elena to sleep with Damon, not ideal, but not too soon in the context of how long they've really been pining for each other, like since at least early season 3 we've watched Elena's longing looks toward Damon, and the fact that SE were not really together physically since the end of season 2, so technically it wasn't sleep with her 24 hours after his brother. SE were together, but not physically together, if you know what I mean. Having said that I also don't think it would be horrible for Stefan to take her back if it turned out the sire bond was the reason for her strong feelings for Damon that ultimately made her sleep with him. I think in that case, that he would forgive it. He probably wouldn't forgive Damon so quickly though. It is not supposed to affect her emotions, however, so we will see. One thing I have learned in this fandom is that people have completely different moral values and feelings on these issues. Some people are disgusted that they both slept with Katherine, that Damon slept with Isabelle (before he knew she was Elena's Mom) and now that they have both slept with Elena, but for me, it isn't about MY morals and what I would do so I don't put them into play when watching the show cause I sure wouldn't murder anyone either.  |
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 18:10:31 GMT -5
okay I was confusing that with the time he kissed Elena saying He thought he didn't have to feel guilty
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Post by Doppelgänger on Jan 14, 2013 18:19:29 GMT -5
It was the same general idea when he kissed her that he thought he didn't have to feel guilty because Stefan was back and on equal footing.
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Post by Slash on Jan 14, 2013 18:38:03 GMT -5
I think everyone in the triangle needs to sit down and think everything out but that's just me. I want to say everyone involved should know better with the past: Katherine. Katherine is the root of a lot of the BS that's going on between the Brothers and Elena knows this. Yet, where is she? Right smack dab in between the Brothers, keeping this gap between them. Intentional? Maybe not, but she has to see that she's retreading this road that her ancestor walked down a century and a half before. You'll love who you'll love but I think at some point, one of the Brothers should (or should have) avoided the 'triangle' when they saw the signs or simply bowed out when it really got out of hand.
Damon ideally could have been the 'better man' and walked away from pursuing Elena until/if she and Stefan ever broke up but not while the 2 were together (but for plot reasons, he gets screwed and pushed back in the direction so what can the guy do but be by his lonesome cause of these awesome people he's surrounded by that he continues to save?). Stefan, at the current junction of the series, should bow out and let Damon & Elena have the chance together instead of throwing the fit and blaming the sire bond entirely. Alternatively, if the story would have gone different with the Ripper stuff, he could have let Damon & Elena have a shot while he was 'rebuilding' his oh, so 'everything is ruined' life and getting the Ripper thing together. He had been gone for 3 months at that time, was still being Ripper-ish (the war with Klaus that fell onto the Gang's doorstep) and could have used some time away. Hell, a road trip with Katherine to finally get a hold on the Ripper for the sake of Elena (in other words, kind of the road Damon traveled to become a better person as the series went on in part due to trying being someone Elena could appreciate). In Stefan's case, Elena may have already thought he was there but to be honest with himself, he should have sidelined himself to that end (not with the intent for Damon to move in, but for Elena in this case).
But you'll already know that I think the triangle should have started off differently. Stefan shows up and Elena is just getting to know him, as friends at first/discovering the mystery but no relationship and then Damon kind of starts popping up. Once the Katherine things falls through, he kind of pushes more towards Elena, who isn't with Stefan yet either but they've grown close and from there, it's Elena struggling with which Brother to actually hook up with. She loves both of them as the series goes on but knows she can only be in love with one. She knows she'll deal a blow to the one she doesn't choose but she feels she needs both of them. At different junctures of the series, she may lean more towards one or the other but it keeps her from being in an official relationship with either one, allows her some liberties compared to her former setup (being with Stefan and still having moments with Damon) and would allow her to view and appreciate both Brothers on the same level/to the same standards (if Stefan screws up, he gets chewed out. If Damon does, he gets chewed out. No free passes. Something more realistic in regards to both Brothers' actions). She sees the good and bad of each, the areas each one excels in and why she thinks each would be perfect for her. Oh, and yeah, the Writers could actually build a f***ing triangle and the 2 male sides up equally instead of the lopsided development heavily in Damon's favor.
The whole Ripper thing with Stefan should have been a better handled storyline within the triangle than what it was/has been. Damon wanting to finally get this dark part of his Brother in check, with Elena to help (the 2 people that love Stefan) and Stefan wanting to finally get it in check for the sake of a future with Elena. At this point, it'd be downplaying the triangle in general and more just helping Stefan finally get this demon in check. It'd be a building/development storyline for all 3 of them as characters.
Meh.
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Jan 14, 2013 19:12:42 GMT -5
Ok..... I'm gonna solve this triangle nonsense once and for all... CAKE!  You're welcome.  Hell that would be the best option for me...if I were Elena.  |
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Post by Ruby2579 on Jan 14, 2013 19:18:47 GMT -5
I agree and even so Stefan has yet to throw a fit about them being together. The little tantrum he had before was discovering they were hooking up behind his.back even if it was only a couple of days. We have to see how he will be when Elena unleashes her.emotions to everyone else.
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