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Post by Slash on Mar 17, 2012 7:35:43 GMT -5
When DE happens, will it even last a season? I think the longest relationship has been SE but then there was a real/fake breakup thrown in there to try and fool Katherine (I don't remember all the details) but everyone else has been so short lived. Caroline and Matt, Caroline and Tyler, Jeremy and Bonnie, Jeremy and Anna, Damon doesn't get a footing with the people he hooks up with and so on. Of the mains, it seems we get something that lasts half a season to a few episodes before half of the couple is killed off or they break up because someone did something (Matt breaking up because of the way Caroline acted, Caroline breaking up with Tyler or coming to a pause because of the whole Sired thing, Bonnie breaking it off with Jeremy because of the Anna thing and so on).
Will we just see a couple run into a problem and actually work through it instead of saying "It's over"? Something long term (2 seasons or so) where their foundation is tested/shook and they stand by another without having to break it off and rebound off of another relationship to get back into it? When DE happens, will it be for 2+ seasons/till the end or will we get half a season of it before Elena is bouncing back to Stefan or just breaks up with Damon for something? Will Caroline end up with someone long term? Can Jeremy and Bonnie use this current time apart as a sort of learning experience, hook back up and then be able to work through whatever problems arise in the future?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2012 12:44:52 GMT -5
I think when Damon and Elena do eventually get together it is of course not going to be sooth sailing throughout the rest of the seasons. Something will break them up for drama's sake (new threat, misunderstanding, it may even be something really silly) and then they will eventually get back together if they're endgame. But yeah when it comes to TVD and it's relationships on this show it's the equivalent of celebrity marriages, they never last  |
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Post by Slash on Mar 17, 2012 15:10:04 GMT -5
I guess I'm naive in thinking that they'd ever go the route mentioned above about getting through any problems in a relationship without breaking the couple up and having them explore other interests. Always some Grand Canyon sized problem they can't get past at the moment by physical means or something they can't sit down and talk about without eying each other from across the room and then leaving/avoiding each other when their eyes meet because it's too hard to break words with one another on the matter. Jeremy & Bonnie is kind of in this boat but at the same time, it's a betrayal of trust by Jeremy in all of it so I can understand Bonnie wanting some time apart but then they kind of threw the wrench in there with Elena sending him away when Bonnie was obviously still trying to come down from the whole thing. I guess he'll be back soon though since the revelation about the Gilbert Rings and the possibility that he could be suffering the same as Alaric as he has suffered a death too and they'd be putting others at risk. Tyler left once again to try and get a hold of being able to change at will to help break his sire bond to Klaus so he can be with Caroline who during his absence, has kind of toyed around with Klaus and even still did the whole jealous thing with Matt. Caroline has obviously got on Klaus' case about the whole Tyler & Sire bond thing and Tyler left for her so I don't understand why she just doesn't 'wait' instead of tiptoeing around the other 2 =\ Why not throw the sink at Klaus in getting him to let Tyler, just one freaking Hybrid, out of the bond if possible. Better yet, why don't the Writers throw some Caroline magic in there and have her take down Klaus all by herself?  |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2012 15:51:40 GMT -5
Most of the relationships on this show has only gone bad because of supernatural aspects. I'm not sure if one couple on here broke up just because of the typical normal means The Bonnie and Jeremy thing. That was a mess! I'm probably one of the only few, but I wasn't a big fan of Bonnie's way of coping with the problem. When Jeremy was explaining what was happening to him Bonnie sort of just avoided him as if the problem would solve itself. Yes it was a lot to take in and she needed some space. But think of Jeremy's situation. He's seeing his dead ex girlfriends. So wouldn't it make sense for current girlfriend to always be around him so that he doesn't have time to think of ex ghost girlfriends? Sit down and hunt through some books together to get rid of this problem? I don't know but I hated how the Bonnie/Jeremy thing turned out. It was just one of the worst ways with this show for a couple to go out. I didn't really like it and I felt things could have gone a different way if they could have both just sat down and talked things out. That's kind of the thing that bugs me with Caroline's character. I could never jump on this Tyler/Caroline thing cause it seemed as if she was still not over Matt. Even now still she gets jealous of who's with Matt but it could also be taken as Rebekah herself has sort of had it in with Caroline's character so it could also be the safety issue with her. Her whole thing with Tyler has been the sire bond thing. So that's why I'm one of those who is really not liking this Klaus/Caroline thing. He has done much worse in regards to Damon and has put the gang through so much pain and trouble in late season 2 and season 3 so it doesn't make sense why she's giving him the time of day. The only thing she should be pressuring him about is his hold on Tyler. If Klaus fancies her so much eventually he'll crack and let Tyler off the hook (if Klaus can even undo this sire thing anyways). |
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Post by Slash on Mar 17, 2012 16:07:22 GMT -5
I've always though the Bonnie & Jeremy thing was an 'assassination' of Jeremy's character. Just the way he acted throughout wasn't what we came to know at that point. Then yes, there is Bonnie's hand in not hearing him out and talking about it. They could have simply sat down and come to the conclusion that he needed to have some closure. Him trying to sneak around behind her back and her avoiding him was just all sorts of weird (par the course of the season).
Caroline isn't over Matt and I think that's why her & Tyler getting together this season took so long (+ that 2 month jump from S2). I think after all the details came out to Matt, she was holding out to see if he'd come around and they could continue something (if I recall, Tyler tried to pursue her but she kept putting him off and strictly kept it a friendship). The whole Klaus thing though...maybe Caroline is a sucker for attention? Otherwise, she shouldn't be giving him the time of day or should be constantly pestering him about Tyler. Tyler is currently the way he is cause Klaus was experimenting and put Tyler's life on the line to make a Hybrid. And if Klaus can't break the bond himself, it's as simple as not giving him any orders anymore or compelling him to forget about the whole 'Klaus' thing. I'd imagine it's like the Maker/Prodigy thing with Vampires where the Maker can severe the bond and the Prodigy can go out on their own free will afterwards but I don't know. The show never really explains a lot of stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2012 16:39:31 GMT -5
I still want to know how the writers are going to redeem Jeremy from that. I can already imagine any interaction between him and Bonnie is going to be awkward Like you said Elena sent Jeremy away before they could solve anything. I kind of forgot how things went but was he compelled to forget the Bonnie thing? If he comes back he won't really be 'Jeremy' he's had so many personality changes because of all this compelling business. If it's like the last time he'll probably come back angry and we'll be in for more angsty Elena/Jeremy moments. The thing about Caroline wanting attention I could see that. She was always a bit insecure, thinking that she wasn't good enough for a guy to want her and that they always go for someone else no matter how hard she tries. I guess Klaus could be the first guy that's interested in her solely unless you count his obsession with Elena/Kat With all the other guys she's been sort of seconds. Damon (Katherine/Elena) Matt (Elena) Tyler (Vicki) |
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Post by pixiestyx on Mar 18, 2012 12:56:26 GMT -5
Well to be honest, it's pretty much like that with ANY show. Couples will get together and be torn apart. I'd like to see DE together for a while before that happens. Who knows, they might surprise me. The Bonnie/Jeremy thing...well I never liked them together anyway but it still could have been handled better. The Caroline/Tyler stuff......well I didn't like them together either  |
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Post by Slash on Mar 18, 2012 13:49:16 GMT -5
^^^ I thought Bonnie & Jeremy was a bit quick and kind of wanted to see more build up but the falling apart of it was just really out of the blue for a lot of people. I'd expect the main couples mainly to be up and down, especially with a triangle involved but every relationship? I think this is the first show I've followed where I noticed this for me or where it's just 'weird'/all over the place with everyone. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2012 12:03:45 GMT -5
The Jeremy and Anna thing did seem out of the blue. If you go back to season 1 it didn't even seem as if he truly loved her as he declared so strongly in the Ghost World ep. Everything about them seemed to be revolved around Vicki who's had more mentions than Anna ever did from Jeremy. It didn't even look as if Jeremy was trying when Anna was being dragged away and after that he seemed to get over her pretty quickly and never talked about her again. I'd find it more believable if he was proclaiming the, "It's always been her." line to Vicki not Anna. I'm not much of a Bonnie/Jeremy or Jeremy/Vicki or Jeremy any fan but I don't like seeing out of character moments like these regarding the relationships. I have the same problem with Damon and Elena. One moment she's crying about the fact that he left her and the next she wants him to stop hounding her all of the time. One moment she doesn't know what she'd do if he weren't there the next she's concocting a plan to get him out of there it's like come on the character consistency is ridiculous Also as I said before the supernatural aspects has had a big effect on all of these couples. Alaric/Isobel - Turned by Damon/ran off Alaric/Jenna - As soon as she found out the truth got turned by Klaus. Vicki/Tyler/Jeremy - Vicki turns and dies Jeremy/Anna - Anna dies by John Gilbert device Jeremy/Bonnie - Ghost storyline malfuction Lexi/Guy that loved her - Lexi staked by Damon Damon/Caroline - Was semi compelled/Human blood bag Damon/Rose - Bit by werewolf and dies Damon/Andie - Used by Stefan to give Damon a warning. Caroline/Matt - Wanted out when he found out she was a vamp. Caroline/Tyler - Her vampirism and his werewolfism was a big problem now it's the sire thing. Matt/Rebekah - Same problem as Caroline/wants normal life. Stefan/Rebekah - Hunted down and staked by Klaus. Bonnie/Luka - Dies by flamethrower when conducting a witch spell. Bonnie/Ben - Vampire using her. Stefan/Elena/Damon/Katherine - Enough said on this angle Damon/Rebekah - Pending Damon/Sage- Pending Bonnie/Jamie - Pending Klaus/Caroline - Pending Sage/Finn - Pending/ But also being boxxed for nearly 900 yrs surely but a wrench in this relationship. Not sure if I missed any but probably the only normal means of break ups were Logan and Jenna when she found out he kept cheating on her and Matt and Elena when things just weren't working out. |
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Post by Slash on Mar 19, 2012 16:18:13 GMT -5
In other words, like we've talked about before, 'killing' people is the Go-To method for the Writers to free things up. It's overdone and annoying =\ And Anna died at John's hands, not the device. Remember, Damon and Mr. Lockwood were also victims of the device but Damon was rescued and Mr. Lockwood had his neck snapped by a Tomb Vampire while in the basement of the building. John personally staked Anna.
The whole Jeremy/Anna thing was probably too confusing for the Writers so they just used her cause she was 'recent'. Having Jeremy go along with Vicki would have made more sense since he knew her longer and had an extended relationship with her compared to Anna. I also think they set Vicki aside from Jeremy just so Matt could have some closure with her and kind of 'divide' the stance with Jeremy wanting to keep Anna around and Matt & Others realizing this shouldn't be happening. It's weird in general though. Anna just wanted to be around Jeremy while she was a Ghost because on the other side, she once again had lost her Mother. The first time she met him, it was to get her Mother out of the Tomb. She was alone and Jeremy was her companion until she found her Mother again. The whole ruining of Jeremy & Bonnie on that front shows you they rigged the couple. If Anna was straightforward about it and Bonnie had sat down with the guy and they explained things, they'd probably still be together. "Hey Bonnie, Anna is alone on the other side without her Mother and I'm the only one who can interact with her. I'm going to help her find her Mother so I might be spending some time with her but I'd love if you could help in all this." How exactly did Pearl show up at the end anyways? Just to give Anna a happy ending?
They need to keep Elena consistent as well but I'm not expecting that. One step forward, Two steps back as usual. She *NEEDS* him one episode like she needs air and then the next, she's snapping his neck and kicking him while he's out because he's 'too' in love with her. Padded walls and a jacket that lets her hug herself is what she needs.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2012 10:43:09 GMT -5
It's also the fact that the JP and the writers don't plan things out for the long run. Vicki was killed off way too early to get anywhere with anyone. They also bring in so many guest stars to mingle in with the main characters only to be killed off later. It was obvious the writers didn't intend for a triangle oh girl-boy-girl and that's why Vicki was suddenly shoved out of the picture even though she was bugging him along with Anna at the beginning. Both she and Anna got their closure. Or at least I think Vicki did. She was a bit relunctant to go. It's kind of sad because she got turned and staked. She could have gone to rehab or something and turned her life around. I say I want Sage and the originals to walk away from this and not get killed as a result of getting stuck in triangles one way or another. Don't know how things will go for Klaus/Caroline, Damon/Bekah, and Damon/Sage. I feel as if the writers are scared that it's too much power out there or something. As in the gang may go, "Oh just call Klaus. Or get Elijah." to solve problems. It's not like they have to bring them back constantly. Maybe surprise them once in a while or check up on them. The only person who has been safe regarding romantic interests is Katherine. I thought she would have been killed off by now because of the whole Elena/Kat/Stefan/Damon thing but they surprised me by keeping her alive. |
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Post by Slash on Mar 20, 2012 13:47:27 GMT -5
That's what I'm hoping when this is all over. The Originals get to 'walk' away from the Writers' Death Hammer and can come back in later seasons to help out or just hang out. They'd have various connections and info that the gang could use for help and even just having that muscle behind them if they do need some extra power would be nice cause lets face it, if the Originals are out of the way, some other baddie that's above them on the Power Scale is going to be brought in and Damon & Stefan already get beat downs enough so having say, Elijah and Klaus team up to help balance the odds would be just great to see. Having those 2 missing for a season and half and then just showing up to kick ass (maybe with Klaus' Hybrids in tow) would make me giddy.
But I expect very little from the Writing staff if this season is any indication.
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Post by lemily23 on Mar 20, 2012 15:26:41 GMT -5
Will we just see a couple run into a problem and actually work through it instead of saying "It's over"? Something long term (2 seasons or so) where their foundation is tested/shook and they stand by another without having to break it off and rebound off of another relationship to get back into it? When DE happens, will it be for 2+ seasons/till the end or will we get half a season of it before Elena is bouncing back to Stefan or just breaks up with Damon for something? Will Caroline end up with someone long term? Can Jeremy and Bonnie use this current time apart as a sort of learning experience, hook back up and then be able to work through whatever problems arise in the future? Perfect post! Basically, this. It's all I want for relationships to last and for couples to work through their problems without jumping to the next love interest when things aren't working out for them. Why bother creating a relationship for these characters in the first place if they are just going to break them up? I'm fine with couples having issues, but it's seeing them work through those issues and potentially become stronger and learn from their mistakes that make couples more appealing, in my opinion. It's a good way to show their growth, but what does that tell about a relationship in general when we don't see this happening? Damon/Stefan/Elena is a big mess right now in my opinion. They are always going to be stuck in this triangle. I know that's the triangle of the show, but I can't see it going anywhere. Elena has feelings for Damon and she loves Stefan too. I can't see any of them being a stable longer term relationship because the other brother will always be there with certain feelings and other complications. I'm not a die hard DE or SE so I honestly don't care too much about who will end up with who and wouldn't mind it at all if the other relationships on the show were more stable. Short term relationships are becoming to be a problem. Caroline/Tyler/Matt/Klaus; what is that? I love Caroline and I hate that she is the girl being passed down from guy to guy. I loved her with Matt in Season 1. I did. I also loved the development with Tyler in Season 2 and knew the writers were going in a different direction with Caroline in terms of her relationship with Matt, but at the same time I hated how things ended with him. He found out she was a vampire and had a realistic reaction to it. I felt sorry for both Caroline and Matt because you could tell they did love each other. She loved him so much and he needed time to come to the realization that Caroline is still a good person despite her being a vampire. Yeah, we never got to see them resolve anything because they had her moving on with Tyler. Like I said before, I loved them and certainly didn't mind them together. They had some good build up and I loved how she was there for him during the werewolf transition. They fell flat to me in Season 3, though and continued going downhill when they started having problems with Tyler being a hybrid. Okay, I don't mind issues between couples if you see that couple try and work them out. What do they do? Ship Tyler off goodness knows where and have Klaus (the person who turned Tyler into a hybrid in the first place and is moving in on his girlfriend while he's away trying to fix himself for said girl). Did we see Tyler and Caroline try to overcome anything? Nope. Tyler is MIA and I have no idea where he is or when he'll be back. I don't know, but moving Caroline from guy to guy just proves that the writers aren't interested in a long term relationship at all. When things get 'hard' they move on. I'm not saying anything is going to happen with Klaus, but it sure looks like it could be going that way. Jeremy/Bonnie: Another wasted potential of a relationship. It took some time for me to warm up to them, but when I did they instantly became my favorite couple. They were definitely a beautiful couple in Season 2 and I loved how they had their struggles when Jeremy was worried about Bonnie sacrificing herself to kill Klaus, but they still stuck with each other. They had a sort of innocence and sweetness to them which was most certainly refreshing on a show like The Vampire Diaries. I wish we could have gotten more build up, but in Season 3 all of that went to hell. They added a third party into the mix and decided, "Oh why not go for a love triangle/square?" Like there aren't enough of those. Things were complicated and they broke them up in the WORST possible way, considering the way they were written for in Season 2 and how they obviously loved each other. What happened in Season 3 continues to make no sense to me. I agree that they were both sort of at fault for this. Bonnie should have listened to Jeremy and should have been there for him more instead of brushing him off and Jeremy shouldn't have kissed Anna and pretended Bonnie didn't even exist. Fine, that happened. I wasn't happy about it and they both made their share of mistakes, but we never got to see them deal with it. Instead, we had a broken-hearted Bonnie and an absent Jeremy. We never got to see them talk things out. Even their break-up was lame. And then what do they do? They compelled Jeremy to leave town right when things could have been resolved with Bonnie and they could have finally had their chance to work things out. They still had no closure, in my opinion. So now, naturally, Bonnie will probably have a new love interest because couples can't go through troubles and tribulations without the writers giving up on them and starting fresh with someone new. It's beginning to look like 90210 and Gossip Girl. They really need to get their stuff together. A lot of these couples have unfinished business and a story that doesn't seem to be over yet and quite frankly shouldn't be over yet. For once, I want them to start a relationship and stick with it. Wow, that turned out to be a lot longer than expected. |
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Post by Slash on Mar 20, 2012 16:56:06 GMT -5
Yep ^ A lot of the stuff doesn't feel like it's concluded. Caroline with Matt *AND* Tyler is still kind of open ended. With Matt, she still cares and it was showing in the beginning of the season where she was still hanging out with Tyler but didn't officially hook up with him over those 2 months because she was still holding out for Matt. There is still some stuff there that needs to be done/concluded between them. Tyler is currently MIA and is trying to break his bond/learn to turn without the pain so you can write that off as 'Unfinished' as well. Worst of all, they try to kickstart her on Klaus when the other 2 aren't finished. Bonnie is the same way. Her and Jeremy are still unfinished but they just sent him off so it'll be stalled till they bring him back and that's if Bonnie isn't with someone else to complicate things more.
These are main/supporting characters hooking up so they don't get killed off. They get sent away for some time (this is Tyler's 2nd trip) or they're just brought into scenes when needed and it's kind of like, "Well, I'm still waiting for their relationship/sidestory with ____ to finish up." With Damon, they kill off any other female he builds a relationship with so it's 'simple' for them with his character so they can keep shoving him back into the triangle (like you, don't really care much for DE or SE; just want to see DE happen so it can happen and he can move on or whatever. Ideally, Elena with someone other than the Brothers would be nice) when he is shown to have connections of some sort with these other girls (like Rose).
I just want to see something long term on the relationship front from the show. The triangle *IS* a mess and I don't see it providing us with that cause it's just going to be back-and-forth with Elena & the Brothers so why can't someone else have a stable relationship?
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Post by lemily23 on Mar 20, 2012 19:38:42 GMT -5
Yep ^ A lot of the stuff doesn't feel like it's concluded. Caroline with Matt *AND* Tyler is still kind of open ended. With Matt, she still cares and it was showing in the beginning of the season where she was still hanging out with Tyler but didn't officially hook up with him over those 2 months because she was still holding out for Matt. There is still some stuff there that needs to be done/concluded between them. Tyler is currently MIA and is trying to break his bond/learn to turn without the pain so you can write that off as 'Unfinished' as well. Worst of all, they try to kickstart her on Klaus when the other 2 aren't finished. Bonnie is the same way. Her and Jeremy are still unfinished but they just sent him off so it'll be stalled till they bring him back and that's if Bonnie isn't with someone else to complicate things more. These are main/supporting characters hooking up so they don't get killed off. They get sent away for some time (this is Tyler's 2nd trip) or they're just brought into scenes when needed and it's kind of like, "Well, I'm still waiting for their relationship/sidestory with ____ to finish up." With Damon, they kill off any other female he builds a relationship with so it's 'simple' for them with his character so they can keep shoving him back into the triangle (like you, don't really care much for DE or SE; just want to see DE happen so it can happen and he can move on or whatever. Ideally, Elena with someone other than the Brothers would be nice) when he is shown to have connections of some sort with these other girls (like Rose). I just want to see something long term on the relationship front from the show. The triangle *IS* a mess and I don't see it providing us with that cause it's just going to be back-and-forth with Elena & the Brothers so why can't someone else have a stable relationship? You've summed up my feelings perfectly. I totally agree with everything. It seems the writers know how to start up relationships, but instead of showing proper build up, they later don't know what to do with them anymore so they leave them open ended and unfinished. I'm still waiting for them to realize this is becoming ridiculous and maybe not the best way to go about things. I guess no relationship is really safe in the long run on this show. I'm hoping for more, and for things to work out for Tyler/Caroline and Bonnie/Jeremy and even have the brothers move on from the absurd triangle. You are exactly right, if this doesn't happen the main tri will still be going on and on, at least have someone else in a stable relationship. I'm still holding out hope for Jeremy/Bonnie and for Caroline/Tyler/Matt to be resolved. I feel like they've written themselves into a major trap adding Klaus into the mix so I can't even begin to speculate where that will be going. My ideal ending for the show in terms of the triangle is have the brothers ride off into the sunset and have Elena marry some non-vampire and have a million babies. |
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