Hybrids - What are the rules?

[Slash]

Yeah, he hated it. He loved that as a Hybrid, he wouldn't have to change anymore unwillingly and since it was under his control, he wouldn't have to change at all. The only reason he did change again was the break the sire bond to be with Caroline.

They really do neglect the other species up until they need them for story purposes.

And it's not just Tyler being in battles but it's all of them. Battles in this show are piss poor if that. They don't really try. They throw a punch here and there and use the super Vampire speed. That's it. Teen Wolf makes the effort and on the same network, you have Nikita and Arrow with some damn choreographers on staff. TVD needs them to stage a decent fight between 'Vampires'. So...underutilized.

And as one of the top shows on the network, you'd think CW would spring for more of a budget for TVD. I know they tried to hold back on the Witch stuff with TSC but come on with TVD. Cut Beauty & The Beast and allocate everything going to that to TVD. If you have to, when Cult folds, have Davis come back and bring the imaginary budget from that show to TVD too. I mean, aside from the occasional flashback episode that's in a different period, where's the money? Nikita does obviously worse in the rating I assume but they have the budget to change up the scenery and do good fights? What? Supernatural is in the same boat.

Pet peeve with this show...

[phoenix]

LOL - I agree with most of what you said. Nikita and Arrow have the most amazing fight scenes compared to TVD. But I am hoping Cult finds a footing. If for no other reason than to have weekly doses of Matt Davis. If I had the luxury of choosing I would of course choose to have Alaric back in TVD. Beauty and the Beast has been disappointing for many reasons but mostly because I don't buy Lana Lang as a detective.

Budget probably is the reason for the lack of werewolf scenes on the show but I think TPTB might also be worried that some fans might start to like the werewolves more than the vampires, like they did with the originals. There are a lot of people who are just down right frustrated with the Damon/Stefan/Elena triangle and I'm sure a lot of them would prefer werewolves to the triangle. I know I wouldn't mind if they switched it up a little.

Don't get me wrong. I still like the trio but a break from the drama of the triangle would be good too.

Anywho........back to hybrids.

It would be nice if the hybrids would stick around for a bit and had actual names. I think it would give us as the audience a perception of their importance which has been lacking up to now. Tyler is a special case as he was introduced to us as one of the main cast so our perception of him will always be a little different. At least it is for me. I view him as one of the friends as opposed to a hybrid. Klaus is also a special case since he's an original and I'm confused as heck as to what his abilities are as a hybrid as opposed to just an original vampire.

[Deleted]

So there are some stuff I agree with and some I disagree with. Yes I think up until this point the hybrids have been fodder. I thought in season 3 we would get a short of showdown between Klaus and his hybrids vs the gang but we didn't. Like I said on a post back Klaus is going to have a hybrid with an actually name and something to do so he'll most likely be sticking around.

I don't think TVD can be compared to some of these other shows like Nikita. Obviously the premise of TVD is the love triangle so it's a bit heavier on the romance. I don't watch Nikita as much as my cousin but I have seen some of the fight scenes and they're cool and all and correct me if I'm wrong Slash, but there's not much romance and much less a triangle that Nikita's stuck in. The plot is more action than romance driven.

While we're on the subject of the triangle I don't really see what that has to do with werewolves' involvement

Even when season 2 focused on Mason/Tyler's werewolf arc and Jules/moonstone arc the triangle was always there. The triangle is always going to be a big part of TVD and will never truly be done with until the series end. It's one of TVD's premises and what most fans are hooked on. On that end if people are tired of the triangle it's the SE relationship that's grating people's nerves. We've had to watch for 4 seasons now.

Also no matter how much focus the werewolves get I don't think they'd ever be more popular than the vampires on the show. People love Damon, Stefan, Caroline, Klaus, Rebekah, and Elijah. Originals or not they're still of the vampire variety. With the exception of Tyler who I don't think is as popular as the main cast. People are already over Forwood and want Klaroline.

Mason/Jules/Brody aren't nearly as talked about since their death as Anna has.

Don't get me wrong I also wouldn't mind if the werewolves got more of a focus and got out of that antagonist range so they can stick around and show off more of their arsenal. Hopefully Hayley's on the gang's side and she and Tyler can do some cool stuff together.

But I doubt that people will like them any more than they already love Stefan, Damon, Caroline etc.

[Slash]

My problem is these are Vampires who have been alive for 100-1000 years and the most they've learned to do in all that time for survival in a confrontation is a few punches, shoves and ripping out the heart if possible. I would just think that someone would be more adept in hand-to-hand than what I mentioned above and really abuse their super strength/speed in a fight. I'm not asking for every no name Vampire/Werewolf/Hybrid to know martial arts like you see in movies but something more than what we've gotten. Something that makes the mains want to explore their abilities and limits in the area.

No, Nikita doesn't have a focus on a triangle but they do have a focus on a relationship/romance between Nikita and Michael and later, Alex and Shaun. It's there, just not in the overdone fashion of a 'triangle' and it's better done that way cause they can just focus on those specific relationships. It balances it out nice cause you get a little of both worlds (action & romance).

I think it's all about how they handle a Werewolf character. I mean, granted they're Originals but I love Bekah, Klaus and Elijah for the characters that they are/have become, not really entirely for being Vampires/Originals. If they were Werewolves/Demons/Necromancers/whatever else, I'd still be enjoying them if they had their history tweaked here and there to accommodate those changes (them having problems with Vampires as Humans and not Werewolves for instance). Great actors behind them and interesting characters that have been written. They can do the exact same thing with a Werewolf character if they tried but they're heavily leaning on the Vampire side of the show which is expected on 'Vampire' Diaries.

One of the things I loved about the past season of True Blood was that the triangle took a back seat. I loved Eric's "f*** Sookie!" attitude and that she was more of a footnote to all the crap that was going on. Having a TVD season where Elena takes a back seat and the other characters are brought to the front with their own storylines and problems (Bonnie's Witch problems, Klaus/Tyler's Hybrid issues, Jeremy as a Hunter, etc.) and the Brothers saying they need a break would be nice but even I know that's asking too much (this would fit in well with a time period after Elena breaks up with Stefan and wants to be single for a while).

[Deleted]

Yeah the fights are kind of watered down in the show compared to the books. But of course since JP nerfed most of the 'vamp' powers that made them awesome in the first place so instead of fights being tactical (Damon manipulating weather/shifting to crow/wolf etc.) we'll just get the generic heart rip or stab through the heart with everyday item tactic.

Masquerade back in season 2 had a good fight sequence with Kat vs Stefan/Damon despite those nerfs though. It stayed true to the power level of Kat's age and we got to see them do more than one thing. Also the fight lasted more than a few seconds. Although that was back when KW was also writing some of the script.

But on werewolves I feel like since the Mason arc and the beginning of Tyler's transition to werewolf arc we haven't seen much of the werewolf stunts. In fact I'm a bit rusty on some of this stuff. Remember back in season 2 when Mason was fighting the guy Damon compelled and he did all those high jumps with the yellow flashy eyes? Was that on a full moon or is that just something that werewolves can do in human form all the time?

"They can do the exact same thing with a Werewolf character if they tried but they're heavily leaning on the Vampire side of the show which is expected on 'Vampire' Diaries."


Basically that's it. Nearly a majority of the cast has been turned into vampires/are vampires. Even though they never have in the books (Vicki, Caroline, Alaric etc.)

Kind of like Teen Wolf is the 'werewolf' show and don't touch much on vampires. (Again correct me if I'm wrong, I don't keep up with that show regularly ).

[Slash]

Wish they would have kept Vamp powers =\ The Katherine fight was one of the better ones of the series because they actually intended for it to be a fight and it'd be nice to see more of those, specifically with the Originals involved. Seeing Damon, Stefan, Caroline, Tyler and Bonnie supporting trying to bring down Klaus? Would be awesome to see (and they'd obviously be outmatched but it'd be a good showcase for a new Hybrid Klaus too). Or Bekah getting into a tussle with Caroline & Elena or Mikael & Klaus actually duking it out. A lot of great fights/match ups that the show has just outright slapped down.

Someone else would have to answer the Mason question in pertaining to if it was near a full moon or not. I'd like to know as well but if you're anything other than a Vampire, info is murky on this show.

The reason Teen Wolf doesn't touch on Vampires is because everyone else is. The creators said they'd only do Vampires after they run out of everything else but they have plans to do 'Weres/Shifters' across the board if they can fit them in (Werecats, Werepanthers, Werebears, we saw the Kanima this past season which was reptilian and they mentioned a 'bestiary' which means the world has quite a few monsters). I'm just glad there are some shows outside of the Vampire thing (Teen Wolf for Weres, Lost Girl covers a succubus and other Fae, True Blood does a decent job of covering a lot of grounds despite Vampires playing king there too and Supernatural covers quite a bit of ground on it's own). Honestly, TVD wouldn't be so bad if they actually expanded on the others, especially Witches since they're so rooted in all the crap going on.

I think I'm a bit hard on TVD though as the triangle bothers me and kind of pushes the other stuff to side which is more enjoyable for me (some of the other characters and the world/mythos). I think some of the other series I'm following (books and shows) are kind of leaking into the TVD part of my brain and clouding it up with expectations, no less with handling relationships better TVD's approach to the triangle is so freaking annoying for me when I'm watching other Supe shows that handle couple setup or the triangle setup better and that the show itself isn't crafted around the triangle formula like TVD. That's hampering the show a bit too much IMO. TVD without that limitation would be better to me but I'm probably the minority in the target audience since the triangle is the draw for many (no matter how poorly it's done...).

We're so off topic right now but it's my topic so whatever

[alexander]

I think it doesn't really change much compared to vampirism. It seems like vampirism is the dominant side of a hybrid, removing the full moon limitation of werewolves. Werewolf blood on the other hand doesn't seem to affect their physical abilities much, only removing some fatal weaknesses.

So basically the hybrids in the show seem a lot more like vampires than werewolves, but are of course young and actually seem a bit slower than vampires? Maybe it's not the werewolf blood buffing up their vampire abilities but actually their vampire side giving some weaker bonuses to their humanwerewolf attributes?

When it comes to turning into a werewolf, I have noticed that it's quite painful, thus making it something they would avoid at all costs if possible.

Also I think the sirebond makes them somewhat dull, like puppies just following their mother. Maybe that's why they seem to make easy targets for the older vampires.

Sidenote: TVD fights. I read a comment about them being too simple and how the older vamps should be more adept at hand to hand combat. I myself enjoy the short fights and it actually makes the long needed difference between Underworld and TVD. Underworld etc. are like the Matrix with fangs, removing the vampire aspect. Sure if I was a 500 year old human, I would be adept at hand to hand, but a vampire's strength is in speed, strength, accuracy and predator instincts. There is little to no point in throwing punches unless it's for the sake of brawling. When you really want to kill an opponent you go for the weak spot faster than he can react and that's it. They do wrestle, though! Pin down the opponent and rip his heart out. That's the way to do it vampirishly!

[Slash]

At this point, the show is just heavily leaning on the Vampire aspect of all things (which I should say is expected given the title of the show). Just think that the Hybrids should have been something special.

TVD fights I'm more comparing to other shows on the network, not Underworld (was comparing the use of Hybrids there). Nikita and Arrow do fight scenes really well/in a satisfying manner. That's all I'd like to see from TVD but all we get is shoving matches and the regular use of super speed. That's it.

Underworld is a different beast with fights but that's due to how the species are setup. Death Dealers and Vampires in general are somewhat at a disadvantage in the universe so they have to rely on what Vampire traits they have (speed, strength, etc.) in conjunction with trying to stay ahead of the curve tech/weapon wise (Silver Nitrate bullets). Lycans are too much of a handful in the series cause they can change at will and it's not long and drawn out either. That gives them the edge in a physical fight (jaws, claws, strength, speed) against your average Vampire. We saw Viktor go toe-to-toe with Raze in his Lycan form (and Raze is from the Lucian/Rebellion days) and win and that was purely experience on his part. He did the same to Michael who was a [newly made] Hybrid (experience vs inexperience against a creature that was the best of both worlds).

I guess what I'm trying to say is I'd just like to see some progression in 'skill' with the TVD Vampires with the age (something that didn't carry over from the books). Nothing 'extreme', but something more than the 'fights' that end in 2-3 actions. The Mikael confrontation was *EMBARRASSING*. Mikael was touted to be some sort of monster and Klaus knocks him on the ground and it's over. What? I understand the 'precise' thing but still, it's gotten a bit 'meh' with everyone having their hearts ripped out and there is really no contention for the win or showing that one would be faster than the other (or it's rarely shown). Guess I'm looking for some 'perks' to being an older Vampire.

I'm complaining out of bias/comparisons and just to complain honestly