liajones
Full Member
It's the ultimate secret, Elena. You'll be happy as never before. And we'll be together, you and I.
Posts: 170
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Post by liajones on Nov 5, 2012 11:52:55 GMT -5
exactly, Stefan made a huge choice concerning Elena behind her back. so he saved Matt's life instead of hers because he respected her choices. but he's making a deal with Klaus without Elena knowing.
the way i see it is as follows, he was willing to strike a deal with Mr Evil (that has sooooo many side effect which have been pointed out by others) regardless of her choice than to save her life.
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Post by Doppelgänger on Nov 5, 2012 12:01:50 GMT -5
Yeah that's the thing about Stefan, he only seems to respect her choices when she might die because of them. This is SO bordering on needing to be moved to the debate thread.  |
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Nov 5, 2012 12:04:36 GMT -5
Now that I have seen the clip from the episode I feel even greater about this. They had a plan to save Matt, April and Jeremy! Everyone is in on it except ...............................Stefan! Why? because of his deal with Klaus. Now this whole cure and Elena becoming human is compromising his decisions to save others. His judgement is clouded now. Had he never made that deal he would have gone along with the plan and never thought twice. This is why this is such a bad idea! Putting the cure and Elena before the others is exactly what Elena wouldn't want. I haven't seen the whole scene obviously but Stefan was obviously worried that they could kill Conner and killing Conner would mean no cure right?
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Nov 5, 2012 12:05:49 GMT -5
Yeah that's the thing about Stefan, he only seems to respect her choices when she might die because of them. This is SO bordering on needing to be moved to the debate thread. This is in the debate thread! I put it there.  |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Nov 5, 2012 12:39:16 GMT -5
Oh, OK.  Did you move it? I didn't think it was or did I imagine it? |
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Post by Slash on Nov 5, 2012 13:01:42 GMT -5
Now that I have seen the clip from the episode I feel even greater about this. They had a plan to save Matt, April and Jeremy! Everyone is in on it except ...............................Stefan! Why? because of his deal with Klaus. Now this whole cure and Elena becoming human is compromising his decisions to save others. His judgement is clouded now. Had he never made that deal he would have gone along with the plan and never thought twice. This is why this is such a bad idea! Putting the cure and Elena before the others is exactly what Elena wouldn't want. I haven't seen the whole scene obviously but Stefan was obviously worried that they could kill Conner and killing Conner would mean no cure right? This. Stefan's back door deal is going to start interfering with other plans to protect the gang if Connor's safety comes into question. He'll delay any action until *HE* can see what's the least likely way to get the gang hurt & let Connor live/escape. Thing is, Connor is in the know so I think this gives him some leverage in what he'll do knowing Klaus & Stefan won't let him die. He's been ballsy since he's shown up but this could push him to a whole other level. This is probably also why Klaus is sending one of his own Hybrids in: someone who will follow directions. Klaus doesn't care about the others in there so all he has to say is 'try, but if it comes to it, save Connor/the Hunter, leave the hostages...save Jeremy if possible'. |
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liajones
Full Member
It's the ultimate secret, Elena. You'll be happy as never before. And we'll be together, you and I.
Posts: 170
|
Post by liajones on Nov 5, 2012 13:14:49 GMT -5
Now that I have seen the clip from the episode I feel even greater about this. They had a plan to save Matt, April and Jeremy! Everyone is in on it except ...............................Stefan! Why? because of his deal with Klaus. Now this whole cure and Elena becoming human is compromising his decisions to save others. His judgement is clouded now. Had he never made that deal he would have gone along with the plan and never thought twice. This is why this is such a bad idea! Putting the cure and Elena before the others is exactly what Elena wouldn't want. I haven't seen the whole scene obviously but Stefan was obviously worried that they could kill Conner and killing Conner would mean no cure right? This. Stefan's back door deal is going to start interfering with other plans to protect the gang if Connor's safety comes into question. He'll delay any action until *HE* can see what's the least likely way to get the gang hurt & let Connor live/escape. Thing is, Connor is in the know so I think this gives him some leverage in what he'll do knowing Klaus & Stefan won't let him die. He's been ballsy since he's shown up but this could push him to a whole other level. This is probably also why Klaus is sending one of his own Hybrids in: someone who will follow directions. Klaus doesn't care about the others in there so all he has to say is 'try, but if it comes to it, save Connor/the Hunter, leave the hostages...save Jeremy if possible'. yeah i think Klaus's plan would be to save both Conor and Jeremy, cuz with things going the way they are, i think Conor is gonna die with Jeremy becoming the new hunter. kind of a back up plan. |
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Post by Slash on Nov 5, 2012 13:22:02 GMT -5
When Connor becomes too much of a problem, Klaus will kill him, hoping that Jeremy gets the tats next. But at that point, Klaus won't be able to compel Jeremy although Jeremy does gain a bit of leverage. Klaus will also probably force him to kill Vampires to complete his tattoo.
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Post by Doppelgänger on Nov 5, 2012 13:24:19 GMT -5
He'll just throw all his hybrids at him to kill figuring he can make more. |
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liajones
Full Member
It's the ultimate secret, Elena. You'll be happy as never before. And we'll be together, you and I.
Posts: 170
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Post by liajones on Nov 5, 2012 13:28:52 GMT -5
Those are my exact thoughts. typical Klaus, throwing people (if they can be considered as ones) under the bus to serve his bigger plan.
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Post by Slash on Nov 5, 2012 13:36:51 GMT -5
Klaus protecting Tyler and throwing the others out makes no sense. I think he'll just grab random people, turn them, and have Jeremy kill them. Klaus killing his own with the idea that he'll be able to make more *IF* this cure/weapon works would be stupid on his part and not something I'd expect of him.
Worse case, if Klaus picks random people, April will end up being one of them. Jeremy will cry, maybe do it or he'll look at Elena & Caroline and think April will fit right in and can learn to control and she'll have some help in doing so (and when Bekah wakes up, she'd have a Vampire friend, a.k.a. a friend for all eternity). At this point, he puts down a Hybrid or two (he knows how) and helps April escape. Problem with this is another character is turned, into a Vampire no less, and Matt is still Mr. Useless.
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liajones
Full Member
It's the ultimate secret, Elena. You'll be happy as never before. And we'll be together, you and I.
Posts: 170
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Post by liajones on Nov 5, 2012 13:48:35 GMT -5
you have a point there, but Klaus can't force Jeremy to kill vamps he doesn't want to kill. so i think his choices will be more precise not that random.
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Post by Ruby2579 on Nov 5, 2012 20:44:20 GMT -5
i just think Elena is a big freaking cry baby. Did Caroline cry when she had to kill a couple of People? Yes she did but she didnt flip the switch.
So Elena saying she is not going to survive this is ridiculous -_- and it really pisses me off. Which her saying that was like a confirmation to Stefan on him having to do this plan
And I dont really take Stefan doing this plan as him being selfish. He is going through extreme measures to make Elena human again, same way he gave himself up to save Damon.
I just think he is blinded by finding this cure for elena that he is not thinking about the consequences. but if he is thinking of a back up plan he is going to eventually need the help of Damon because lets face it. the salvatore brothers work best when they in on the plan together.
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Post by Slash on Nov 5, 2012 21:14:21 GMT -5
Well, would you expect any less from 'Princess Elena'? Caroline didn't flip a switch and you know why? She learned from her mistake. Elena can do the same. It seems stupid to say that even the best of them end up killing someone accidentally and then completely ignore the fact that all those Vampires have learned control through those mistakes. Elena needs to shut up with the whining cause she's got 3 people helping her (Stefan, Damon and Caroline; hell even Tyler can probably help or if they want, give Lexi a call via Jeremy) and Stefan needs to stop filling her with fear on the matter. It's not helping she sitting there worried about "Am I a Ripper?".
It's Stefan being Stefan. Remember Damon was going to get out of the way but Stefan completely blocked him on that by locking him up and putting himself in Klaus' hands? He screwed up with Elena and now he's putting himself right back next to Klaus to 'fix' that mistake.
Salvatores work best if Damon pitches an idea and has others tweak it if necessary (getting rid of necessary loss of life). Stefan coming in and saying they're not moving till he knows what's happening is quite the tout on his part when everyone else is on board.
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Post by Sweetluv4DE on Nov 6, 2012 2:38:07 GMT -5
I think the point of selfishness is rooted with something Stefan said in the pilot about wanting someone human. I don't personally think Stefan really wants Elena to be a vampire. I don't think he ever did or ever wanted to push the subject. And not bc he knew she didn't want it but he knew he didn't want it. See how difficult it is already for him to deal with her vamperism. Stefan needs to forgive and love himself first. He can't deal with who he is so how can he deal with who Elena is now. I think we are going to see a rift coming. Stefan is going to push himself and Elena away. We are going to see Stefan dealing with the fact tha HE never wanted this for HIM! And because of that I think a part of him will risk everything even lie to Elena and endanger some folks so that he can have that easier more satisfying girlfriend/relationship. But this is my own opinion and diagnosing of character. If finding the cure was strictly JUST for Elena then ya he's just being a dumby but I think it's partly for him too and because of the risks involved that is why I call selfishness.
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