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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 9:33:15 GMT -5
If all three of the core actors aren't really on board for a 7th season, I think JP should just find a way to end it this season. Having one of the three randomly disappear for a new season and still trying to continue that on seems silly, as that will be a complete change in dynamics and veer off from the central point of the show it was advertised as.
In TVD verse the main draw for me is Delena and the dynamics of Damon/Elena's chacters with each other. So Ian or Nina leaving would just be boring as obviously that means Delena is over. If Nina leaves it's just going to be Damon with random girls or Bonnie and vice versa with Ian leaving Elena will be with randoms or Stefan again.
Stefan and Elena without Ian is obviously borderline suicide for ratings.
Stefan and Damon solely will bore me as well as the Defan relationship is incredibly one sided and without Elena as a buffer, things will fall into Stefan is good brother and Damon the bad one with everyone against him and Damon obviously not really caring to defend himself or win points like a score board.
While the idea of Stefan/Damon past life flashbacks sounds interesting, JP might as well do a one season spinoff entirely not tack it onto what will be the 7th season of an established show with dynamics people have already grown familiar with.
Also no cheap stand ins or look a likes. That's just a complete insult to the original actors role. And fans of their fave in the trio will obviously complain and the chemistry between new and old might just suck. Also it's not fair to the new actor either who will feel pressured to fill someone's shoes or their own 'spin' to the character might not be welcome amongst fans. Fans have grown attached to these characters and when you talk Damon, you picture Ian. I really doubt something like this will happen anyways as JP didn't bring in someone to mimic Bekah on Originals, just altered the story.
In TVD's case given how many seasons it has, it might just be better to end it if not everyone of the main 3 is onboard,
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Post by beangelic1000 on Aug 16, 2014 10:28:31 GMT -5
I wouldn't find the show boring with just Ian, Micheal, Zack, Matt, Kat, Candice, Steven and Michael Malarkey, because Damon is such a complex and interesting character and can be very unpredictable, so in regards to this the character works as a stand-alone character. He also has the most diverse interactions with each of the gang which makes for a more interesting storyline. Because Damon can either be friend or enamy given the situation, whereas, Stefan gets along with everyone, and Elena tends not to want to offend her friends. Damon on the other hand has no such worry.
Which is why I stated that the show would survive with just Ian......
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 10:46:05 GMT -5
I wouldn't find the show boring with just Ian, Micheal, Zack, Matt, Kat, Candice, Steven and Michael Malarkey, because Damon is such a complex and interesting character and can be very unpredictable, so in regards to this the character works as a stand-alone character. He also has the most diverse interactions with each of the gang which makes for a more interesting storyline. Because Damon can either be friend or enamy given the situation, whereas, Stefan gets along with everyone, and Elena tends not to want to offend her friends. Damon on the other hand has no such worry. Which is why I stated that the show would survive with just Ian...... Yeah to each their own. I won't care much for the romance between Damon and other random girls or Bonnie, especially tacked on as a 7th season. I also won't care for Damon being made out as the bad guy of the gang or have him act more OCC and everyone say something like 'Oh cause Elena isn't here and he's lashing out' or whatever. I just don't believe the writing will hold up to drag on this story any further. Some people can still watch regardless as long as their fav actor/character is still present. I'm watching mainly for the relationship between Damon and Elena so if either are gone, I don't particularly care anymore. The side characters and mythology is great, but Delena is the reason I tuned in for this long and if that's gone I don't really feel compelled to watch as actively anymore. But again that's just MY opinion and how I feel on the matter. The show can still be made to be great for others. |
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Post by missmystic on Aug 16, 2014 11:36:06 GMT -5
I wouldn't find the show boring with just Ian, Micheal, Zack, Matt, Kat, Candice, Steven and Michael Malarkey, because Damon is such a complex and interesting character and can be very unpredictable, so in regards to this the character works as a stand-alone character. He also has the most diverse interactions with each of the gang which makes for a more interesting storyline. Because Damon can either be friend or enamy given the situation, whereas, Stefan gets along with everyone, and Elena tends not to want to offend her friends. Damon on the other hand has no such worry. Which is why I stated that the show would survive with just Ian...... Yeah to each their own. I won't care much for the romance between Damon and other random girls or Bonnie, especially tacked on as a 7th season. I also won't care for Damon being made out as the bad guy of the gang or have him act more OCC and everyone say something like 'Oh cause Elena isn't here and he's lashing out' or whatever. I just don't believe the writing will hold up to drag on this story any further. Some people can still watch regardless as long as their fav actor/character is still present. I'm watching mainly for the relationship between Damon and Elena so if either are gone, I don't particularly care anymore. The side characters and mythology is great, but Delena is the reason I tuned in for this long and if that's gone I don't really feel compelled to watch as actively anymore. But again that's just MY opinion and how I feel on the matter. The show can still be made to be great for others. My feelings are kind of in between both of you. But I think my opinion is being influenced by my feelings about season 5, which are extremely negative (in case you didn't already know that LOL). I feel like season 5 wasn't about Delena at all, at least until the end, especially compared to the other 4 seasons. And Elena and Stefan were both pretty useless. I watch for Delena as well, and if you had asked me at the end of season 2 if I would keep watching the show if Nina left, my answer would have been NO. But after this last season, if they don't turn the Delena relationship around in a way that is deserving of the beautiful finale they gave us, and things go back to being crappy, I could see myself getting over Delena and not being sorry to see Nina leave the show. So if that's the turn things took, I could watch the show for Damon, if they had the change be organic and didn't pair him with someone that made no sense or didn't compliment him. I could live with it. |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Aug 16, 2014 11:45:44 GMT -5
Yeah to each their own. I won't care much for the romance between Damon and other random girls or Bonnie, especially tacked on as a 7th season. I also won't care for Damon being made out as the bad guy of the gang or have him act more OCC and everyone say something like 'Oh cause Elena isn't here and he's lashing out' or whatever. I just don't believe the writing will hold up to drag on this story any further. Some people can still watch regardless as long as their fav actor/character is still present. I'm watching mainly for the relationship between Damon and Elena so if either are gone, I don't particularly care anymore. The side characters and mythology is great, but Delena is the reason I tuned in for this long and if that's gone I don't really feel compelled to watch as actively anymore. But again that's just MY opinion and how I feel on the matter. The show can still be made to be great for others. My feelings are kind of in between both of you. But I think my opinion is being influenced by my feelings about season 5, which are extremely negative (in case you didn't already know that LOL). I feel like season 5 wasn't about Delena at all, at least until the end, especially compared to the other 4 seasons. And Elena and Stefan were both pretty useless. I watch for Delena as well, and if you had asked me at the end of season 2 if I would keep watching the show if Nina left, my answer would have been NO. But after this last season, if they don't turn the Delena relationship around in a way that is deserving of the beautiful finale they gave us, and things go back to being crappy, I could see myself getting over Delena and not being sorry to see Nina leave the show. So if that's the turn things took, I could watch the show for Damon, if they had the change be organic and didn't pair him with someone that made no sense or didn't compliment him. I could live with it. Yeah I'm in the middle too on this really. I want Delena...and if I can't have Delena I want Elena gone for good. That's the only way I could see Damon getting over her because he would have to. I always thought a spin off show with Damon and Alaric would have been fun, with them chasing down bad vamps and solving vampire and supernatural dilemmas so if I can't have my perfect Delena ending that would be my second choice. I'd rather Damon go back to being the bad boy who isn't in love with anyone if Delena ended. I don't want to see him love anyone else. |
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Post by beangelic1000 on Aug 16, 2014 12:38:57 GMT -5
One of the main reasons for the loss of 3M+ veiwers was the fact that there was too much focus on the triangle and less focus on being supernatural creatures. This was one of the main complaints across the board, these veiwers just wanted to watch a vampire show, but unfortunately, the characters persisted of vampires apologising for being vampires, except for one, Damon. For them, out of all characters who are vampires on the show, Damon is the only one they consider true to his nature. And it is not unthinkable for Damon to be true to his nature and still be the hero. Which is why he can be friend or enemy...and what I mean by that is......Damon in protection mode (protecting the people he loves and cares about) can be a formidable enemy.
Which is why Damon makes such a great stand-alone-character. He is not afraid to be hated if it is a means to an end. He is not afraid to be seen as the bad guy, if it serves a purpose. He does what it takes to keep everyone alive, even if it means those whose lives he is protecting resents his methods. And he sees no problem with being a vampire and makes no apologies for being true to his nature. They have already started the ball rolling with the change in dynamics of the group for season 6, it has created a new buzz in those who had long since stopped watching the show and had become jaded, so this reboot, this reset has certainly got those who had lost interest in the show, interested again.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 15:19:15 GMT -5
Yeah to each their own. I won't care much for the romance between Damon and other random girls or Bonnie, especially tacked on as a 7th season. I also won't care for Damon being made out as the bad guy of the gang or have him act more OCC and everyone say something like 'Oh cause Elena isn't here and he's lashing out' or whatever. I just don't believe the writing will hold up to drag on this story any further. Some people can still watch regardless as long as their fav actor/character is still present. I'm watching mainly for the relationship between Damon and Elena so if either are gone, I don't particularly care anymore. The side characters and mythology is great, but Delena is the reason I tuned in for this long and if that's gone I don't really feel compelled to watch as actively anymore. But again that's just MY opinion and how I feel on the matter. The show can still be made to be great for others. My feelings are kind of in between both of you. But I think my opinion is being influenced by my feelings about season 5, which are extremely negative (in case you didn't already know that LOL). I feel like season 5 wasn't about Delena at all, at least until the end, especially compared to the other 4 seasons. And Elena and Stefan were both pretty useless. I watch for Delena as well, and if you had asked me at the end of season 2 if I would keep watching the show if Nina left, my answer would have been NO. But after this last season, if they don't turn the Delena relationship around in a way that is deserving of the beautiful finale they gave us, and things go back to being crappy, I could see myself getting over Delena and not being sorry to see Nina leave the show. So if that's the turn things took, I could watch the show for Damon, if they had the change be organic and didn't pair him with someone that made no sense or didn't compliment him. I could live with it. Yeah the writing for Delena wasn't particularly good in season 5. Though of course if one or the other is gone, Delena will have NO further writing/relationship whatsoever in comparison to both characters being present and getting bad writing overall. And as much as I want to jump on the staying for Damon boat, yeah we know Damon is the best written character and watching him is entertaining and he IS the show. But I know that just because Nina is out of the picture or whatever, doesn't mean that things will be all Damon fun and everyone is going to love him and whatnot. There will still be Stefan, Caroline, Matt, Tyler etc. other characters who are still apart of TVD. Still view Damon as the bad guy while see Stefan as good. Still make snarky comments about Damon lashing out etc. It's going to be the same thing except without Elena there. Of course the writers could keep true to the character and make Damon not love anyone else. Being in love with Kat for 145 years and taking up to the finale in season 5 to get to a point where he and Elena both accept themselves and each other in the relationship. That'd be true to the character, but how good is it for ratings. Or how long can it go on before people get bored and just want to see Damon in another dynamic with another female. Maybe even Bonnie. It wouldn't be the first time the writers made Damon do something completely OOC. There's also the potential 'writing out' story to give to Elena that could also add to the state of OOC ness. Of course these are all just assumptions not necessarily a given. Though I am the type that when I ship a pairing that I really love, I don't like seeing those characters with anyone else. So if I'm going to be annoyed and pissed at Damon's possible romance story, then I might as well not tune in because it NOT happening is very unlikely given his popularity and how much people ship Damon happiness overall. I just wouldn't enjoy it but again that's just me lol |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 15:40:29 GMT -5
One of the main reasons for the loss of 3M+ veiwers was the fact that there was too much focus on the triangle and less focus on being supernatural creatures. This was one of the main complaints across the board, these veiwers just wanted to watch a vampire show, but unfortunately, the characters persisted of vampires apologising for being vampires, except for one, Damon. For them, out of all characters who are vampires on the show, Damon is the only one they consider true to his nature. And it is not unthinkable for Damon to be true to his nature and still be the hero. Which is why he can be friend or enemy...and what I mean by that is......Damon in protection mode (protecting the people he loves and cares about) can be a formidable enemy. Which is why Damon makes such a great stand-alone-character. He is not afraid to be hated if it is a means to an end. He is not afraid to be seen as the bad guy, if it serves a purpose. He does what it takes to keep everyone alive, even if it means those whose lives he is protecting resents his methods. And he sees no problem with being a vampire and makes no apologies for being true to his nature. They have already started the ball rolling with the change in dynamics of the group for season 6, it has created a new buzz in those who had long since stopped watching the show and had become jaded, so this reboot, this reset has certainly got those who had lost interest in the show, interested again. To address your first point, TVD was advertised as a triangle from the start and it's based on the similiar named books, also a triangle. It's obvious from the first episode what type of show this would be, it's a teen/young adult geared show on the CW. No one should have really felt tricked in what the focus was on. TVD is not The 'Monster' or 'Supernatural' Diaries. It was never advertised as an episodic monster of the week type deal. Complaints and low viewship ratings stemmed from the writers having Elena glued to Stefan and barely acknowledging Damon. Season 3 is the worst offender, building up what looked to be a Delena finale to Elena choosing Stefan instead. Add season 4's sire bond and season 5's toxic and killing off Damon storyline. People complaining about TVD's triangle or vampires not being vampires make no sense to me. There ARE vampire shows/movies out there that will fill the criteria they're complaining about. |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Aug 16, 2014 16:54:50 GMT -5
One of the main reasons for the loss of 3M+ veiwers was the fact that there was too much focus on the triangle and less focus on being supernatural creatures. This was one of the main complaints across the board, these veiwers just wanted to watch a vampire show, but unfortunately, the characters persisted of vampires apologising for being vampires, except for one, Damon. For them, out of all characters who are vampires on the show, Damon is the only one they consider true to his nature. And it is not unthinkable for Damon to be true to his nature and still be the hero. Which is why he can be friend or enemy...and what I mean by that is......Damon in protection mode (protecting the people he loves and cares about) can be a formidable enemy. Which is why Damon makes such a great stand-alone-character. He is not afraid to be hated if it is a means to an end. He is not afraid to be seen as the bad guy, if it serves a purpose. He does what it takes to keep everyone alive, even if it means those whose lives he is protecting resents his methods. And he sees no problem with being a vampire and makes no apologies for being true to his nature. They have already started the ball rolling with the change in dynamics of the group for season 6, it has created a new buzz in those who had long since stopped watching the show and had become jaded, so this reboot, this reset has certainly got those who had lost interest in the show, interested again. To address your first point, TVD was advertised as a triangle from the start and it's based on the similiar named books, also a triangle. It's obvious from the first episode what type of show this would be, it's a teen/young adult geared show on the CW. No one should have really felt tricked in what the focus was on. TVD is not The 'Monster' or 'Supernatural' Diaries. It was never advertised as an episodic monster of the week type deal. Complaints and low viewship ratings stemmed from the writers having Elena glued to Stefan and barely acknowledging Damon. Season 3 is the worst offender, building up what looked to be a Delena finale to Elena choosing Stefan instead. Add season 4's sire bond and season 5's toxic and killing off Damon storyline. People complaining about TVD's triangle or vampires not being vampires make no sense to me. There ARE vampire shows/movies out there that will fill the criteria they're complaining about. I agree. The majority of the complainers and quitters of the show were Delena fans up until season 4 with a huge amount leaving at the end of season 3 because of the ridiculous choice by Elena. We lost at least half of our regular board members at around that time. It wasn't til Delena became a couple that we then saw Stelena fans start complaining and quitting as well and since Delena was still being thrown cheap tricks, the Delena fans also kept leaving the show as well since we never really ever got to see happy Delena for more than a few minutes at a time. That made for a dissatisfying experience for everyone overall. They complained about the triangle because they dragged it on way past it's shelf life instead of having Elena definitively choose one or the other. It was her waffling that people started to hate with a passion. Now in season 5 we had more waffling from both parts of Delena with the toxic thing. The writers just did a poor job of writing what a triangle should look like, frankly. |
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Post by beangelic1000 on Aug 16, 2014 17:51:25 GMT -5
Yes, it was advertised as a triangle, however, as you well know, it was OUR fandom who led the call for the end of the triangle, and even now continue to let the SE fans know that Elena and Stefan are now friends. It is OUR fandom who tell SE that their ship is dead, therefore, the triangle no longer exist. If that is the case, then we are already no longer following the books, which is not only about a triangle involving Elena being in love with two brothers but also with Damon being in love with Elena who he has named his Princess of Darkness, but also secretly in love with Bonnie who he calls his Little Redbird. I'm referring to the books written by L.J. Smith that goes up to Midnight, and even now her books Evensong: Paradice Lost and War of the Roses carry on with this exact theme where Midnight left off, only now the others are beginning to suspect, so L.J is continuing writing a double triangle.
Addressing the show itself, it is a show about witches, vampires and werewolves and at least the veiwers who deserted the show by season 4 expected a lot more in this regards. And if you recall one of the biggest complaints is that when it comes to being a vampire with strengths and powers TV Damon is not a patch on even the book Damon.
The show like the books although involved a triangle, it also like the books is about the struggle for power among the supernatural beings and how the Salvatore brothers, Elena and her friends handle these other supernatural beings, and some of the battle are brutal. So yes the complaints about the supernatural beings on the show are very valid. Because the books were not focused on just the different triangles occuring it was also about the battle between the different supernatural beings, and on this front, the show didn't even match the books. In the books, Damon was as strong or even stronger then some of the vampires who were older then he was, in the books Damon came armed with a lot more supernatural abilities, that doesn't exist on the show. I get why they stopped with the fog and the raven, but there are a lot moe abiilites that TV Damon didn't have that book Damon had. Therefore, again the complaints about the way the vampires, werewolves and witches are represented is still valid, because, the people who came to watch this show were disappointed in how not so supernatural in comparison with the books the supernatural beings were on the show.
And the vampire most sinned against was Damon whose powers had been stripped to the bare minimum. So for the viewers who just came to watch the show for the supernatural element that is very much front and centre in the books, the show fell short so by S4 the 5M+ viewers that the show started with had dwindled to an average of 2M which it is still averaging now. Only now the ship wars and the tit for tat not watching if a scene is heavily in favour of one ship over another appears to be spoiling everyones enjoyment of the show, and has done little to entice back the veiwers that had been lost. Which is why this S6 reset and reboot has got those who had long since given up on this show, excited again, because it is a do over, which is why if Ian is one of the two who has signed up for the 7th season bodes well for TVD, because the network would love the show to run for at least 10 seasons, because worldwide TVD is their biggest success story. Warner Brothers don't even mind if the show runs for 17 seasons based on its worldwide success.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 18:41:00 GMT -5
Yes, it was advertised as a triangle, however, as you well know, it was OUR fandom who led the call for the end of the triangle, and even now continue to let the SE fans know that Elena and Stefan are now friends. It is OUR fandom who tell SE that their ship is dead, therefore, the triangle no longer exist. If that is the case, then we are already no longer following the books, which is not only about a triangle involving Elena being in love with two brothers but also with Damon being in love with Elena who he has named his Princess of Darkness, but also secretly in love with Bonnie who he calls his Little Redbird. I'm referring to the books written by L.J. Smith that goes up to Midnight, and even now her books Evensong: Paradice Lost and War of the Roses carry on with this exact theme where Midnight left off, only now the others are beginning to suspect, so L.J is continuing writing a double triangle. Addressing the show itself, it is a show about witches, vampires and werewolves and at least the veiwers who deserted the show by season 4 expected a lot more in this regards. And if you recall one of the biggest complaints is that when it comes to being a vampire with strengths and powers TV Damon is not a patch on even the book Damon. The show like the books although involved a triangle, it also like the books is about the struggle for power among the supernatural beings and how the Salvatore brothers, Elena and her friends handle these other supernatural beings, and some of the battle are brutal. So yes the complaints about the supernatural beings on the show are very valid. Because the books were not focused on just the different triangles occuring it was also about the battle between the different supernatural beings, and on this front, the show didn't even match the books. In the books, Damon was as strong or even stronger then some of the vampires who were older then he was, in the books Damon came armed with a lot more supernatural abilities, that doesn't exist on the show. I get why they stopped with the fog and the raven, but there are a lot moe abiilites that TV Damon didn't have that book Damon had. Therefore, again the complaints about the way the vampires, werewolves and witches are represented is still valid, because, the people who came to watch this show were disappointed in how not so supernatural in comparison with the books the supernatural beings were on the show. And the vampire most sinned against was Damon whose powers had been stripped to the bare minimum. So for the viewers who just came to watch the show for the supernatural element that is very much front and centre in the books, the show fell short so by S4 the 5M+ viewers that the show started with had dwindled to an average of 2M which it is still averaging now. Only now the ship wars and the tit for tat not watching if a scene is heavily in favour of one ship over another appears to be spoiling everyones enjoyment of the show, and has done little to entice back the veiwers that had been lost. Which is why this S6 reset and reboot has got those who had long since given up on this show, excited again, because it is a do over, which is why if Ian is one of the two who has signed up for the 7th season bodes well for TVD, because the network would love the show to run for at least 10 seasons, because worldwide TVD is their biggest success story. Warner Brothers don't even mind if the show runs for 17 seasons based on its worldwide success.
I don't remember DE's calling for an 'end' to the triangle. At least not in the first three seasons of TVD that were practically SE, ending with Elena choosing Stefan and the first half of season 4 was also filled with Stelena. In fact we were the ones that were against the notion of the triangle needing to end since technically the triangle never even started. That's all SE's complaining about wanting the triangle to end since the show was heading in the direction of DE and they didn't like that. They wanted it to be a quick phase and then have SE again. Some SE's felt like there was a 'triangle' going on and wanted it over before Elena and Damon even got into a romantic relationship.
As of 4x23 where Elena confessed to Damon and chose him up to season 5's finale and her jumping in that car with Damon with the thought of them dying together, it's safe to say the triangle as far as Elena's feelings and who she wants to be with is over.
Of course now DE's are confidently saying the triangle is over. We certainly weren't saying something like that in season 2 or 3. Would it make sense for the triangle to be ongoing after season 5's finale, or after a full season of Elena being completely faithful to Damon and non wavering in her choice and staying true to her choice of choosing Damon, faults and all? It would make no sense for Elena to do a 180 and go back to Stefan. DE fans aren't just throwing around baseless claims of the triangle being 'over/dead'. That's what we've been shown in show.
Also I'm not sure I understand your view about the TV show being about supernaturals. You can say the books definitely were. Damon and Katherine were vampires who could shape shift (also Stefan after he consumed more human blood), there were things like the Malach who took control of Damon, the Kitsune twins, Sage who was part demon/vampire with a hellhound, the whole Dark Dimension that had a mixture of different beings, and not to mention Elena herself who was this combination of an angel/spirit/ with wings and her own unique powers. There were also other weird things (like I remember Bonnie and co. getting attacked by trees? in a forest and a lady in the Dark Dimension who shifted into an owl to attack Bonnie/Elena). Not only that, the book also has other supernatural/magic things like memories that you can store into orbs and place it to your forehead or something to view that current memory, things like the 'Black Rose' that Damon loved, and weird 'ground' creatures that threatened to pull Matt under whenever he, his friend, and the old lady from the border house needed to put their arm down this hole to look for something (which I've obviously forgot this far in time lol) So the books obviously has the show beat as far as supernatural things go in general.
I've read the books so I know it didn't always focus on the triangle on every single page or chapter (most of the time Damon's character would have long absences since he didn't technically live with Stefan) and there were other moments like school drama with Caroline that had focus and of course after LJ came back from her break, the Return series went up the wazoo with the supernaturals and crazy stuff in between all the 'triangle' stuff. As far as the triangle goes in the books, the relationship between Damon and Elena, is an incredibly slow burn. Book Elena was the queen of denial and development took foreverrrrr!
But back to the supernaturals. The TV show itself has stripped Damon of his powers, he and Katherine could both no longer shape shift. The only supernaturals we've seen were vampires (a given), werewolves, and witches/warlocks and to an extent ghosts. The show hasn't nearly done anything as crazy as the books have with Kitsune foxes or hellhounds or shift shaping beings of animals other than a werewolf. In the books Damon turned human through some flowers meant for Stefan given by a Kitsune, in the show, it was just some generic liquid in a bottle. The show never really goes to out there for things like the book does.
This is why I was excited for Sage's character (since I thought they'd be like the book counterpart) and why I've been hoping for the Kitsune fox twins/person and some new being in the dimension that Damon/Bonnie is in because the TV show has literally done nothing too out there from the norm of witches/vamps/wolves.
If anything the 'supes' that have been fleshed out are the vampires. We have your normal/typical vampire, the Originals, the Hunter Vamp who has the powers of an Original and feeds on vamps, and then the genetically altered Augustine vamps. Obviously instead of having three different other variations of vampires, the show could have easily used other supernatural beings in general to fill those roles. But JP didn't bother.
If you make a list of the supernatural species found in the books compared to the show, the books will have a longer list because JP herself has said she doesn't want to make the show seem 'too supernatural' hence why Damon was stripped of his book powers after the first episode. So if Damon flying, controlling fog, and to an extent his crow, was too supernatural in her terms.
Having some new species show up with powers like having hellhounds in the books or Japanese fox twins would obviously fit into that category as well.
And sorry that this is getting way off of topic lol
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Post by beangelic1000 on Aug 17, 2014 5:42:57 GMT -5
I have a sneaky feeling that all three have signed up for S7, however, we still have to wait for actual confirmation. From everything I've heard from Julie Plec in interviews there is definately going to be a S7. However, on my travels around the social Media and different boards, it is amazing just how alive and excited the people who had once been cynical and jaded about the show, and had simply stopped watching have become.
The brave move by JP and the producers of the show who have decided to do a Do-Over, a complete reboot of the show, a reset of the group dynamics among the regular cast members has sparked a new interest in S6. The show having all the different characters in different places doing different things, has made for an interesting start to the season. With Damon and Bonnie in another World, Stefan off by himself somewhere, Aleric trying to come to terms with his supernatural status while trying to support Elena. Jeremy deciding to take himself right way from his cousin/sibling and live in a Mystic Falls where no supernatural being can enter, thus with the exception of Matt and Tylor has cut himself off from the main group. Enzo now that he has made it back alive from the other side, but with no Damon to focus on must find himself a new purpose in life. Matt, also has cut himself off from the group and is livng happily in Mystic Falls with a new job and making new friends. Tylor also appears to be happy living in a supernatural free Mystic Fall, but unlike Matt and Jeremy has to be super careful since he still carries the werewolf gene. Elena will be pre-med and also making new friends at the hospital. Caroline whose dream was to be at college with Elena and Bonnie, and have all the the gang together, now has this dream shattered as everyone has drifted away from each other and are living diffrent lives, so she will be working very hard to change this......
So yes the change in dynamics is going to make for a very interesting S6 and possible S7.
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Post by Doppelgänger on Aug 17, 2014 8:36:08 GMT -5
I beg to differ on this statement of yours Bean: If that is the case, then we are already no longer following the books, which is not only about a triangle involving Elena being in love with two brothers but also with Damon being in love with Elena who he has named his Princess of Darkness, but also secretly in love with Bonnie who he calls his Little Redbird.
I've read ALL the books LJ Smith wrote and I never got the impression that Damon was in love with Bonnie, secretly or otherwise. I know Bamons claim otherwise but that's just their interpretation. To me, in the books, he is fond of the little redheaded girl who faints at the drop of a hat because she is so delicate and SHE has a crush on him, not the other way around. That endears her to him but I wouldn't say he is in love with her by any stretch of the imagination. He is in love with Elena. The show Bonnie is so far from the book Bonnie in personality that the entire dynamic between Damon and Bonnie in the books really wouldn't translate to the show. She is not a delicate naïve little flower in the show. She doesn't need Damon watching out for her. She's quite capable of taking care of herself, but every chance they have gotten for Damon to help her, they have, and to me that is still giving a nod to the books, but Bonnie does not have a crush on Damon in the TV show. If they suddenly were to throw that at us now it would be completely ooc.
We've sort of veered off topic with this 'triangle' talk, although I do find it interesting to hash over why we think people are no longer watching the show, but that's really another topic altogether and up for interpretation depending on who you ask in the fanbase. If you ask the SEs they'd tell you it's because DE got together! I think through season three we had a pretty committed fanbase. It wasn't until the awful choice Elena made that people gave up on the show in droves. To me that was the first really huge mistake they made that lost them fans. Then they kept trying to keep Delena apart and more people got bored and stopped watching. Also some SEs quit the show because SE was done and some people who preferred some lesser characters and weren't happy that they weren't getting enough air time quit as well. But nobody can deny that the largest fanbase is DE. In polls both SE and DB do horribly for votes as a couple so they are not nearly as popular, especially DB. If you hang out where they do though, you're going to think there's a lot of them, but there simply isn't. Of course there's the fake Bamons who are really SEs and just want Damon out of the way so their ship can have a chance again! So doing DB would be a flop and maybe cause more fans to quit rather than gaining some back.
I have not seen very much enthusiasm about the upcoming season. I think some DBs are getting their hopes up and will be disappointed, but the rest of us just hope it doesn't suck really badly and we still get to see Damon a lot who is by far the most popular character on the show with almost everyone. Something like 70% of fans say he's their favorite.
I do wish they'd have given us more supernatural elements to the show instead of making it more like a soap opera with vampires in it. Caroline Dries said in an interview last year that they were going to get farther away from the supernatural element and that was disappointing to me. I'd say they did do that last season. I don't think it was a good choice. They certainly haven't said they plan to add back more of the supernatural elements either. They are talking about doing more interpersonal relationship development instead, which we get on every other show there is. So I don't hold out much hope for more supernatural elements in the show.
Lastly, if the hold out on signing is Ian then they may as well pack up the show and quit. It will lose so many viewers that it won't even be worth airing and go out with a whimper rather than ending well. So I hope they offer him whatever he wants to stay and that we get a whole lot more Damon, but if what he wants is DB instead of DE with his ex, that will fail miserably.
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Post by beangelic1000 on Aug 17, 2014 10:40:08 GMT -5
I also have the books that L.J.Smith wrote, and have been reading them over very carefully. And it is very clear that not only has she built up a relationship with Elena being in love with both Stefan and Damon with Stefan as her preferred boyfriend despite what she felt for Damon, she was in the very early stages of building the relationship with Damon now very deeply in love with his Princess of Darkness, while also slowly becoming attracted to Bonnie, L J may have an odd writng style in the way she goes about expressing the various ways that Damon responds to both Elena and Bonnie, that some mght see it as him taking a special interest in Bonnie because she is tiny and need protecting, however, it is a lot more then that, and that is becoming clearer in her Evensong Books, that continue after Midnight and reading them it is like she never stopped writing because it links beautifully. Everyone knew that Bonnie loved Damon, however, Stefan now know he has feelings for Bonnie even though he know he is very much in love with Elena, and Matt is starting to realise and is very angry towards Damon on Elena's behalf.
In regards to the show, and I've repeated this several times, S1 and S2 was supposed to be the slow build up of Damon and Bonnie's relationship, however, it was decided to backburner this relationship and focus on the triangle, therefore, the reason why they have not interacted in the way required for the foundation of their friendship is because it was backburner and that coincided with the firing of L.J in S2 (2010/2011), which is why I stated had they continued with this relationship we would not be having this conversation right now. Ian himself the minute they made this decision has made his thoughts on this subject very clear over the years, so it is old news in that regards.
So of all the feasable ways to kick start this friendship and new bond that is going to be formed, they have actually gone with the best choice. Damon and Bonnie forced to spend time together, and actually see beneath all the hostilities and come to a new understanding of each other, and what makes them tick is a good way to go.
And also the same about all the new dynamics to be formed with the rest of the gang makes for a interesting S6
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Post by Doppelgänger on Aug 17, 2014 10:49:57 GMT -5
I also have the books that L.J.Smith wrote, and have been reading them over very carefully. And it is very clear that not only has she built up a relationship with Elena being in love with both Stefan and Damon with Stefan as her preferred boyfriend despite what she felt for Damon, she was in the very early stages of building the relationship with Damon now very deeply in love with his Princess of Darkness, while also slowly becoming attracted to Bonnie, L J may have an odd writng style in the way she goes about expressing the various ways that Damon responds to both Elena and Bonnie, that some mght see it as him taking a special interest in Bonnie because she is tiny and need protecting, however, it is a lot more then that, and that is becoming clearer in her Evensong Books, that continue after Midnight and reading them it is like she never stopped writing because it links beautifully. Everyone knew that Bonnie loved Damon, however, Stefan now know he has feelings for Bonnie even though he know he is very much in love with Elena, and Matt is starting to realise and is very angry towards Damon on Elena's behalf. In regards to the show, and I've repeated this several times, S1 and S2 was supposed to be the slow build up of Damon and Bonnie's relationship, however, it was decided to backburner this relationship and focus on the triangle, therefore, the reason why they have not interacted in the way required for the foundation of their friendship is because it was backburner and that coincided with the firing of L.J in S2 (2010/2011), which is why I stated had they continued with this relationship we would not be having this conversation right now. Ian himself the minute they made this decision has made his thoughts on this subject very clear over the years, so it is old news in that regards. So of all the feasable ways to kick start this friendship and new bond that is going to be formed, they have actually gone with the best choice. Damon and Bonnie forced to spend time together, and actually see beneath all the hostilities and come to a new understanding of each other, and what makes them tick is a good way to go. And also the same about all the new dynamics to be formed with the rest of the gang makes for a interesting S6 I guess it's a matter of opinion but I don't think even LJ Smith is going to go full bore Bamon and the ghost writer certainly didn't either. Either way I think you're reading too much into it and spending too much time with Bamons if you're starting to believe that's even a possibility on the TV show. Look at the actual relationship that Damon and Bonnie have on the TV show. They are miles away from anything romantic and for something like that to develop naturally it would take a long time. The show doesn't have a long time so at best Bamon would be given a cheap shot at it. Would any Bamon even be happy with that? Look how long it took to develop Delena and how carefully they stepped slowly toward that. Bamon would have to go through the same steps for it to be 'organic' and believeable. They're still in the 'well I don't hate you as much as I used to' stage. I think they are going to become better friends and have a better understanding of each other because they have been thrown together. But their relationship is based upon their mutual love for Elena and their understanding of how far they will each go for Elena is what they have in common. The common denominator between Damon and Bonnie is Elena and it always has been. |
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