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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 12:50:07 GMT -5
To be fair I blamed writers not vampirism. And it was always there but the balance was more equal. Equal compassion to equal selfishness made her great to see. If vampirism really does increase what's there her compassion should not have nearly died out. It's like Tyler season 2 + 3 he was a great character to me. Now he's just there and is so dull. I dont mind more realistic characters but when it comes at the expense of what made the character good then it's not good. If she is "main lead" then the other characters should not be so much better or likeable. Now she just seems like a dull self centred plot device and not a character. And it just bugs me. I do know what you mean. One of my first complaints about Elena was that she didn't seem as compassionate as she used to be but that started in season 3 from my perspective and yes, it made her less likeable for sure. Oh it started getting worse in 3 but I think it wasn't as bad as she had Delena moments when Stefan Ripper as well as Stelena moments of worrying about ripper enough but on 4 there was less compassion and it's not about shipping in case people think i blame that but look at early on Elena comforting Damon when he was bit by werewolf. Then season 4 they are together but all the scenes were sex or "**** everyone i want my man" she never thought how he might be feeling ... it got bad like I could tolerate 3 as there was enough good but 4 5 6 it's like the writers changed her to fit. whatever scene they needed. They need fan service ship teases? she suddenly only cared about that, family issue? she cared for that scene only , It got silly. The story + scenes should fit the characters NOT the other way IMO |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2015 14:14:34 GMT -5
I do know what you mean. One of my first complaints about Elena was that she didn't seem as compassionate as she used to be but that started in season 3 from my perspective and yes, it made her less likeable for sure. Oh it started getting worse in 3 but I think it wasn't as bad as she had Delena moments when Stefan Ripper as well as Stelena moments of worrying about ripper enough but on 4 there was less compassion and it's not about shipping in case people think i blame that but look at early on Elena comforting Damon when he was bit by werewolf. Then season 4 they are together but all the scenes were sex or "**** everyone i want my man" she never thought how he might be feeling ... it got bad like I could tolerate 3 as there was enough good but 4 5 6 it's like the writers changed her to fit. whatever scene they needed. They need fan service ship teases? she suddenly only cared about that, family issue? she cared for that scene only , It got silly. The story + scenes should fit the characters NOT the other way IMOWelcome to the writing of this show. A lot of characters suffered from the writers changing them to fit whatever scenario/plot device they needed at the time. After her great development in season 2, Caroline's character was suddenly reduced to the mouthpiece of the Stelena fandom and she was more all about Stefan and his problems and Stelena's relationship than anything else. Bonnie's character only ever shows up when they need magic and now more recently to ship tease Bamon. Enzo, tragic past and friends with Damon one season. Is suddenly all about Stefan and hardly any scenes with Damon this season. Same with Alaric, it's flipping a coin with whether he's a friend of Damon's or not. Damon's character development was always sacrificed for shock value moments and is Stefan in perfect control of his bloodlust and ripper tendencies or is that only ever an issue when the writers actually remember it? So yeah there's tons of examples of characters overcoming issues or acting a certain way seasons ago that suddenly gets rewritten for convenience.
When's the last time Elena ever uttered the word family or baby? Since when was that ever her goal? She was offered the cure once, rejected it, handed it again and jammed it in Katherine's mouth. I don't wear blinders when it comes to certain characters of mine so I can easily point out flaws and spot BS when I see it but I won't pretend that it only exists with a certain character of the show while all my faves are written flawlessly lol cause it's honestly a problem the show suffers as a whole.
As much as it sucks that Nina is leaving, thus the end of the only relationship that kept my attention on the show, the only good thing that does come of this is that at least this way Elena's character is spared further lame writing and fanbaiting, since it's obvious the writers could care less about development and consistency to the point they forget their own canon and rules in the show. Now if only Damon could catch a train with her out of JP's clutches....
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 16:25:51 GMT -5
Oh it started getting worse in 3 but I think it wasn't as bad as she had Delena moments when Stefan Ripper as well as Stelena moments of worrying about ripper enough but on 4 there was less compassion and it's not about shipping in case people think i blame that but look at early on Elena comforting Damon when he was bit by werewolf. Then season 4 they are together but all the scenes were sex or "**** everyone i want my man" she never thought how he might be feeling ... it got bad like I could tolerate 3 as there was enough good but 4 5 6 it's like the writers changed her to fit. whatever scene they needed. They need fan service ship teases? she suddenly only cared about that, family issue? she cared for that scene only , It got silly. The story + scenes should fit the characters NOT the other way IMOWelcome to the writing of this show. A lot of characters suffered from the writers changing them to fit whatever scenario/plot device they needed at the time. After her great development in season 2, Caroline's character was suddenly reduced to the mouthpiece of the Stelena fandom and she was more all about Stefan and his problems and Stelena's relationship than anything else. Bonnie's character only ever shows up when they need magic and now more recently to ship tease Bamon. Enzo, tragic past and friends with Damon one season. Is suddenly all about Stefan and hardly any scenes with Damon this season. Same with Alaric, it's flipping a coin with whether he's a friend of Damon's or not. Damon's character development was always sacrificed for shock value moments and is Stefan in perfect control of his bloodlust and ripper tendencies or is that only ever an issue when the writers actually remember it? So yeah there's tons of examples of characters overcoming issues or acting a certain way seasons ago that suddenly gets rewritten for convenience.
When's the last time Elena ever uttered the word family or baby? Since when was that ever her goal? She was offered the cure once, rejected it, handed it again and jammed it in Katherine's mouth. I don't wear blinders when it comes to certain characters of mine so I can easily point out flaws and spot BS when I see it but I won't pretend that it only exists with a certain character of the show while all my faves are written flawlessly lol cause it's honestly a problem the show suffers as a whole.
As much as it sucks that Nina is leaving, thus the end of the only relationship that kept my attention on the show, the only good thing that does come of this is that at least this way Elena's character is spared further lame writing and fanbaiting, since it's obvious the writers could care less about development and consistency to the point they forget their own canon and rules in the show. Now if only Damon could catch a train with her out of JP's clutches....
For sure...I am quite worried about what will happen with Damon now that you mention it... |
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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 17:14:53 GMT -5
Oh it started getting worse in 3 but I think it wasn't as bad as she had Delena moments when Stefan Ripper as well as Stelena moments of worrying about ripper enough but on 4 there was less compassion and it's not about shipping in case people think i blame that but look at early on Elena comforting Damon when he was bit by werewolf. Then season 4 they are together but all the scenes were sex or "**** everyone i want my man" she never thought how he might be feeling ... it got bad like I could tolerate 3 as there was enough good but 4 5 6 it's like the writers changed her to fit. whatever scene they needed. They need fan service ship teases? she suddenly only cared about that, family issue? she cared for that scene only , It got silly. The story + scenes should fit the characters NOT the other way IMOWelcome to the writing of this show. A lot of characters suffered from the writers changing them to fit whatever scenario/plot device they needed at the time. After her great development in season 2, Caroline's character was suddenly reduced to the mouthpiece of the Stelena fandom and she was more all about Stefan and his problems and Stelena's relationship than anything else. Bonnie's character only ever shows up when they need magic and now more recently to ship tease Bamon. Enzo, tragic past and friends with Damon one season. Is suddenly all about Stefan and hardly any scenes with Damon this season. Same with Alaric, it's flipping a coin with whether he's a friend of Damon's or not. Damon's character development was always sacrificed for shock value moments and is Stefan in perfect control of his bloodlust and ripper tendencies or is that only ever an issue when the writers actually remember it? So yeah there's tons of examples of characters overcoming issues or acting a certain way seasons ago that suddenly gets rewritten for convenience.
When's the last time Elena ever uttered the word family or baby? Since when was that ever her goal? She was offered the cure once, rejected it, handed it again and jammed it in Katherine's mouth. I don't wear blinders when it comes to certain characters of mine so I can easily point out flaws and spot BS when I see it but I won't pretend that it only exists with a certain character of the show while all my faves are written flawlessly lol cause it's honestly a problem the show suffers as a whole.
As much as it sucks that Nina is leaving, thus the end of the only relationship that kept my attention on the show, the only good thing that does come of this is that at least this way Elena's character is spared further lame writing and fanbaiting, since it's obvious the writers could care less about development and consistency to the point they forget their own canon and rules in the show. Now if only Damon could catch a train with her out of JP's clutches....
To be fair after what Damon did to her and how he used her it made sense she would not like him and like irl if you see a friend dating someone you "know" is bad for them you try to make the, see it. Plus Stefan helped her cope with been a vampire so Caroline's at least made sence. Like or hate that she's for Stelena and agaist Delena it made complete sense for the character that's why now she's seen damon was willing to die to save Stefan it made her see he's changed and season 6 shes more for Delena as she knows her friend can be happy  that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 17:19:00 GMT -5
Welcome to the writing of this show. A lot of characters suffered from the writers changing them to fit whatever scenario/plot device they needed at the time. After her great development in season 2, Caroline's character was suddenly reduced to the mouthpiece of the Stelena fandom and she was more all about Stefan and his problems and Stelena's relationship than anything else. Bonnie's character only ever shows up when they need magic and now more recently to ship tease Bamon. Enzo, tragic past and friends with Damon one season. Is suddenly all about Stefan and hardly any scenes with Damon this season. Same with Alaric, it's flipping a coin with whether he's a friend of Damon's or not. Damon's character development was always sacrificed for shock value moments and is Stefan in perfect control of his bloodlust and ripper tendencies or is that only ever an issue when the writers actually remember it? So yeah there's tons of examples of characters overcoming issues or acting a certain way seasons ago that suddenly gets rewritten for convenience.
When's the last time Elena ever uttered the word family or baby? Since when was that ever her goal? She was offered the cure once, rejected it, handed it again and jammed it in Katherine's mouth. I don't wear blinders when it comes to certain characters of mine so I can easily point out flaws and spot BS when I see it but I won't pretend that it only exists with a certain character of the show while all my faves are written flawlessly lol cause it's honestly a problem the show suffers as a whole.
As much as it sucks that Nina is leaving, thus the end of the only relationship that kept my attention on the show, the only good thing that does come of this is that at least this way Elena's character is spared further lame writing and fanbaiting, since it's obvious the writers could care less about development and consistency to the point they forget their own canon and rules in the show. Now if only Damon could catch a train with her out of JP's clutches....
To be fair after what Damon did to her and how he used her it made sense she would not like him and like irl if you see a friend dating someone you "know" is bad for them you try to make the, see it. Plus Stefan helped her cope with been a vampire so Caroline's at least made sence. Like or hate that she's for Stelena and agaist Delena it made complete sense for the character that's why now she's seen damon was willing to die to save Stefan it made her see he's changed and season 6 shes more for Delena as she knows her friend can be happy that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault Caroline was getting along fine with Damon for a long time there and she wasn't being judgy with Elena about him when Elena wasn't sure about her feelings in that one conversation where Elena says, "What does it say about me?" And Caroline says, "It says you're human." She didn't judge. She didn't say, "It says you are a freaking idiot for being attracted to psycho boy," which is more along the lines of the things she said in season 4. The issue I have with Caroline is that they changed her more neutral stance of Damon to a hatred that didn't exist in the season before. |
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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 17:27:41 GMT -5
To be fair after what Damon did to her and how he used her it made sense she would not like him and like irl if you see a friend dating someone you "know" is bad for them you try to make the, see it. Plus Stefan helped her cope with been a vampire so Caroline's at least made sence. Like or hate that she's for Stelena and agaist Delena it made complete sense for the character that's why now she's seen damon was willing to die to save Stefan it made her see he's changed and season 6 shes more for Delena as she knows her friend can be happy that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault Caroline was getting along fine with Damon for a long time there and she wasn't being judgy with Elena about him when Elena wasn't sure about her feelings in that one conversation where Elena says, "What does it say about me?" And Caroline says, "It says you're human." She didn't judge. She didn't say, "It says you are a freaking idiot for being attracted to psycho boy," which is more along the lines of the things she said in season 4. The issue I have with Caroline is that they changed her more neutral stance of Damon to a hatred that didn't exist in the season before. See I took it earlier that she more hoping Elena would choose the "right" choice on her own. Plus her friendship with Stefan grew and grew so her friend was hurt as damon stole his gf (I know some will say he didnt but she was his first so to the characters it looks that way and to some viewers) and she never liked damon she have been respectful or polite in groups but she never seemed to like him. Add it all up and it makes sense she'd be bitter to theirr pairings and never felt out of character to me it seemed to mesh with everything. So part of her hatred was she never liked him after all of it plus hurting her friend by stealing his gf means he was untrustworthy to her and her other friend was been suckered in. Now that may not be how viewers felt but we must remember not all but most of the times damon showed he had changed was in private with no caroline around. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2015 17:35:02 GMT -5
Welcome to the writing of this show. A lot of characters suffered from the writers changing them to fit whatever scenario/plot device they needed at the time. After her great development in season 2, Caroline's character was suddenly reduced to the mouthpiece of the Stelena fandom and she was more all about Stefan and his problems and Stelena's relationship than anything else. Bonnie's character only ever shows up when they need magic and now more recently to ship tease Bamon. Enzo, tragic past and friends with Damon one season. Is suddenly all about Stefan and hardly any scenes with Damon this season. Same with Alaric, it's flipping a coin with whether he's a friend of Damon's or not. Damon's character development was always sacrificed for shock value moments and is Stefan in perfect control of his bloodlust and ripper tendencies or is that only ever an issue when the writers actually remember it? So yeah there's tons of examples of characters overcoming issues or acting a certain way seasons ago that suddenly gets rewritten for convenience.
When's the last time Elena ever uttered the word family or baby? Since when was that ever her goal? She was offered the cure once, rejected it, handed it again and jammed it in Katherine's mouth. I don't wear blinders when it comes to certain characters of mine so I can easily point out flaws and spot BS when I see it but I won't pretend that it only exists with a certain character of the show while all my faves are written flawlessly lol cause it's honestly a problem the show suffers as a whole.
As much as it sucks that Nina is leaving, thus the end of the only relationship that kept my attention on the show, the only good thing that does come of this is that at least this way Elena's character is spared further lame writing and fanbaiting, since it's obvious the writers could care less about development and consistency to the point they forget their own canon and rules in the show. Now if only Damon could catch a train with her out of JP's clutches....
To be fair after what Damon did to her and how he used her it made sense she would not like him and like irl if you see a friend dating someone you "know" is bad for them you try to make the, see it. Plus Stefan helped her cope with been a vampire so Caroline's at least made sence. Like or hate that she's for Stelena and agaist Delena it made complete sense for the character that's why now she's seen damon was willing to die to save Stefan it made her see he's changed and season 6 shes more for Delena as she knows her friend can be happy that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault I wasn't talking about her hate for Damon. I didn't mention Damon's name anywhere in what you bolded. I was talking about her being the mouthpiece of the SE fandom and Stefan. Scenes where she guilt trips Elena and shames her for hurting Stefan. Putting all the blame on Elena like Stefan did no wrong. She hung out and acted more of a friend to Stefan than Elena who she knew since childhood. She made a gross remark of Damon only being nice to Elena cause he was hoping he'd sleep with her. I remember the quotes vividly cause it was just dumb. 'Well he was always there when I needed him'.'That's cause he was hoping you'd sleep with him'. She acted like Stefan had no flaws and was perfect that was my main complaint. Only this season did the writers make her see Stefan realistically. And she can hate Damon, who cares, not everybody is going to like everybody. But most of her hate for Damon was obvious fanbaiting. 'Can you imagine all the girls Damon has probably brought in this bathtub?' Most of the lines were just stupid to me. |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 17:35:07 GMT -5
Caroline was getting along fine with Damon for a long time there and she wasn't being judgy with Elena about him when Elena wasn't sure about her feelings in that one conversation where Elena says, "What does it say about me?" And Caroline says, "It says you're human." She didn't judge. She didn't say, "It says you are a freaking idiot for being attracted to psycho boy," which is more along the lines of the things she said in season 4. The issue I have with Caroline is that they changed her more neutral stance of Damon to a hatred that didn't exist in the season before. See I took it earlier that she more hoping Elena would choose the "right" choice on her own. Plus her friendship with Stefan grew and grew so her friend was hurt as damon stole his gf (I know some will say he didnt but she was his first so to the characters it looks that way and to some viewers) and she never liked damon she have been respectful or polite in groups but she never seemed to like him. Add it all up and it makes sense she'd be bitter to theirr pairings and never felt out of character to me it seemed to mesh with everything. So part of her hatred was she never liked him after all of it plus hurting her friend by stealing his gf means he was untrustworthy to her and her other friend was been suckered in. Now that may not be how viewers felt but we must remember not all but most of the times damon showed he had changed was in private with no caroline around. C'mon he did not STEAL Stefan's girlfriend. Is she an object to steal? Stefan broke up with her and then Elena started a relationship with Damon, not during. Furthermore, Stelena was on the rocks since the beginning of season 3 and not even really together so much. Stefan told her he didn't want to be with her back when she went after him and put on the pretty dress (that Damon bought her so she could BE with Stefan), so they were hardly even really together that season at all but Elena was going to try to be with Stefan until HE broke up with her. So nobody stole anybody. Stefan was gone for a long time. Delena got closer during that time. Damon loved her, yes, but that isn't something you can control. He also spent a lot of time trying to keep Stelena together, defending Stefan and explaining his actions to Elena, etc. |
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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 17:38:26 GMT -5
To be fair after what Damon did to her and how he used her it made sense she would not like him and like irl if you see a friend dating someone you "know" is bad for them you try to make the, see it. Plus Stefan helped her cope with been a vampire so Caroline's at least made sence. Like or hate that she's for Stelena and agaist Delena it made complete sense for the character that's why now she's seen damon was willing to die to save Stefan it made her see he's changed and season 6 shes more for Delena as she knows her friend can be happy that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault I wasn't talking about her hate for Damon. I didn't mention Damon's name anywhere in what you bolded. I was talking about her being the mouthpiece of the SE fandom and Stefan. Scenes where she guilt trips Elena and shames her for hurting Stefan. Putting all the blame on Elena like Stefan did no wrong. She hung out and acted more of a friend to Stefan than Elena who she knew since childhood. She made a gross remark of Damon only being nice to Elena cause he was hoping he'd sleep with her. I remember the quotes vividly cause it was just dumb. 'Well he was always there when I needed him'.'That's cause he was hoping you'd sleep with him'. She acted like Stefan had no flaws and was perfect that was my main complaint. Only this season did the writers make her see Stefan realistically. And she can hate Damon, who cares, not everybody is going to like everybody. But most of her hate for Damon was obvious fanbaiting. 'Can you imagine all the girls Damon has probably brought in this bathtub?' Most of the lines were just stupid to me. True but they were interlocked I felt I.e as mush she wanted to help her friend stefan with Stelena means she hated Delena as much at the time I feel one was cause of the other and vise versa |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 17:41:19 GMT -5
I wasn't talking about her hate for Damon. I didn't mention Damon's name anywhere in what you bolded. I was talking about her being the mouthpiece of the SE fandom and Stefan. Scenes where she guilt trips Elena and shames her for hurting Stefan. Putting all the blame on Elena like Stefan did no wrong. She hung out and acted more of a friend to Stefan than Elena who she knew since childhood. She made a gross remark of Damon only being nice to Elena cause he was hoping he'd sleep with her. I remember the quotes vividly cause it was just dumb. 'Well he was always there when I needed him'.'That's cause he was hoping you'd sleep with him'. She acted like Stefan had no flaws and was perfect that was my main complaint. Only this season did the writers make her see Stefan realistically. And she can hate Damon, who cares, not everybody is going to like everybody. But most of her hate for Damon was obvious fanbaiting. 'Can you imagine all the girls Damon has probably brought in this bathtub?' Most of the lines were just stupid to me. True but they were interlocked I felt I.e as mush she wanted to help her friend stefan with Stelena means she hated Delena as much at the time I feel one was cause of the other and vise versa Yeah so she mistreated her childhood friend in favor of a ripper vampire she hardly knew. I always find it funny how everyone acts like Stefan is NOT a ripper who can go off at any time and act like he is a great choice for a boyfriend, perfect, wonderful, nothing at all wrong with him....it makes no sense. But anyway this convo is veering more into anti-Caroline territory by the minute. I used to like the girl but she lost me when she started that crap with Elena. |
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Post by missmystic on Apr 17, 2015 17:47:13 GMT -5
I wasn't talking about her hate for Damon. I didn't mention Damon's name anywhere in what you bolded. I was talking about her being the mouthpiece of the SE fandom and Stefan. Scenes where she guilt trips Elena and shames her for hurting Stefan. Putting all the blame on Elena like Stefan did no wrong. She hung out and acted more of a friend to Stefan than Elena who she knew since childhood. She made a gross remark of Damon only being nice to Elena cause he was hoping he'd sleep with her. I remember the quotes vividly cause it was just dumb. 'Well he was always there when I needed him'.'That's cause he was hoping you'd sleep with him'. She acted like Stefan had no flaws and was perfect that was my main complaint. Only this season did the writers make her see Stefan realistically. And she can hate Damon, who cares, not everybody is going to like everybody. But most of her hate for Damon was obvious fanbaiting. 'Can you imagine all the girls Damon has probably brought in this bathtub?' Most of the lines were just stupid to me. True but they were interlocked I felt I.e as mush she wanted to help her friend stefan with Stelena means she hated Delena as much at the time I feel one was cause of the other and vise versa I think what Anbu and Doppel are saying is that they overdid it. They waaayyy exaggerated her hatred of Delena and her cheerleading of Stelena. For example, realistically, yes she cared about Stefan and they were friends, but at that point in the story she had not even known Stefan for a whole year yet. She'd been friends with Elena for their entire lives. And therefore her friendship with Elena should have come first and foremost. So if Elena was trying to figure things out, or having feelings for someone other than Stefan, what would have made much more sense is if Caroline had been kind about expressing her opinion. Which she definitely was not. She might have thought Stefan was better for Elena, but a real friend would never bad mouth the other guy that brutally ALL the time to her dear friend who cares about that person. And she would never take Stefan's side over Elena's. It made no sense. But that's what they did, and that was over the top in my opinion. There are other ways they could have had her express her opinion other than being a tota "bitca" (that's Xander speak for b*tch, in case you did't remember that line from Buffy  ) |
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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 17:51:17 GMT -5
See I took it earlier that she more hoping Elena would choose the "right" choice on her own. Plus her friendship with Stefan grew and grew so her friend was hurt as damon stole his gf (I know some will say he didnt but she was his first so to the characters it looks that way and to some viewers) and she never liked damon she have been respectful or polite in groups but she never seemed to like him. Add it all up and it makes sense she'd be bitter to theirr pairings and never felt out of character to me it seemed to mesh with everything. So part of her hatred was she never liked him after all of it plus hurting her friend by stealing his gf means he was untrustworthy to her and her other friend was been suckered in. Now that may not be how viewers felt but we must remember not all but most of the times damon showed he had changed was in private with no caroline around. Stefan broke up with her and then Elena started a relationship with Damon, not during. Furthermore, Stelena was on the rocks since the beginning of season 3 and not even really together so much. Stefan told her he didn't want to be with her back when she went after him and put on the pretty dress (that Damon bought her so she could BE with Stefan), so they were hardly even really together that season at all but Elena was going to try to be with Stefan until HE broke up with her. So nobody stole anybody. Stefan was gone for a long time. Delena got closer during that time. Damon loved her, yes, but that isn't something you can control. He also spent a lot of time trying to keep Stelena together, defending Stefan and explaining his actions to Elena, etc. Hey i'll stop treating her like an object when they stop writing her like one! But yes to adress the rest. To be fair they were close in season 2. In season 2 he told her he loved her and compelled it away BUT series 1 he kept trying things and even kissed katherine cause he thought she was Elena. The fact is he kept been with her and kept hoping for more. Stefan became the ripper to save Damon and damon even tells her "remember how you feel when stefans home" that is kinda dickish and eash for some I didnt say all but easy for some characters and viewers to feel that way. Now that doesn't stop their love been real or been huge. But in some eyes he totally stole her from his brother. I admit like i've said in the past I loved Delena and even i felt he stole her. I may have liked or wanted him to steal her but I still felt bad for the stefan character and felt Damon IMO is awesome but an untrust worthy dick. "who ever she picks the other leaves town" she chose stefan. Damon stays. "who ever she picks the other leaves town" Stefan said goodbye and whent to leave. he only came back as his evil doppelgänger was around and tried to kill him. But yes in all of the series added up Damon + Elena were sort of jerks to stefan but thats ok I just understand why characters like caroline or some viewers see it that way |
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Post by chrizakathemole on Apr 17, 2015 17:57:59 GMT -5
True but they were interlocked I felt I.e as mush she wanted to help her friend stefan with Stelena means she hated Delena as much at the time I feel one was cause of the other and vise versa Yeah so she mistreated her childhood friend in favor of a ripper vampire she hardly knew. I always find it funny how everyone acts like Stefan is NOT a ripper who can go off at any time and act like he is a great choice for a boyfriend, perfect, wonderful, nothing at all wrong with him....it makes no sense. But anyway this convo is veering more into anti-Caroline territory by the minute. I used to like the girl but she lost me when she started that crap with Elena. Her friend who got over real fast the fact friend (bonnie)'s mother was killed by Damon. Or all her friends blamed poor matt for Elena been vampire, or tried to take everything Caroline wanted early on. ect.... Elena is not a good friend lol BUT stefan has been to caroline. Honestly I think the reason we all pretend Stefan is not a ripper is a) he controls it more now and b) we like him. It's like we like Damon and excuse the fact he killed Jeremy , Tyler's uncle , Bonnie's mother and way more. We like them so we excuse the bad. Like Klaus. He's a main character on a spin off in which we route for him! He's done horrible things but we like him lol |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 18:04:50 GMT -5
C'mon he did not STEAL Stefan's girlfriend. Is she an object to steal? Stefan broke up with her and then Elena started a relationship with Damon, not during. Furthermore, Stelena was on the rocks since the beginning of season 3 and not even really together so much. Stefan told her he didn't want to be with her back when she went after him and put on the pretty dress (that Damon bought her so she could BE with Stefan), so they were hardly even really together that season at all but Elena was going to try to be with Stefan until HE broke up with her. So nobody stole anybody. Stefan was gone for a long time. Delena got closer during that time. Damon loved her, yes, but that isn't something you can control. He also spent a lot of time trying to keep Stelena together, defending Stefan and explaining his actions to Elena, etc. Hey i'll stop treating her like an object when they stop writing her like one! But yes to adress the rest. To be fair they were close in season 2. In season 2 he told her he loved her and compelled it away BUT series 1 he kept trying things and even kissed katherine cause he thought she was Elena. The fact is he kept been with her and kept hoping for more. Stefan became the ripper to save Damon and damon even tells her "remember how you feel when stefans home" that is kinda dickish and eash for some I didnt say all but easy for some characters and viewers to feel that way. Now that doesn't stop their love been real or been huge. But in some eyes he totally stole her from his brother. I admit like i've said in the past I loved Delena and even i felt he stole her. I may have liked or wanted him to steal her but I still felt bad for the stefan character and felt Damon IMO is awesome but an untrust worthy dick. "who ever she picks the other leaves town" she chose stefan. Damon stays. "who ever she picks the other leaves town" Stefan said goodbye and whent to leave. he only came back as his evil doppelgänger was around and tried to kill him. But yes in all of the series added up Damon + Elena were sort of jerks to stefan but thats ok I just understand why characters like caroline or some viewers see it that way Well I don't agree and I think Damon went above and beyond NOT to try to get Elena to fall for him and to stay with his brother despite the fact that he was in love with her. In fact it is that very selflessness that caused Elena to fall in love with him in 3x01 when he once again brought her that necklace that signified Stelena's love. Why did he do those things if he was trying to steal her? Why did he shield her from the info that Stefan was on a ripper rampage if he was trying to steal her? Why did he explain Stefan's actions on more than one occasion if he was trying to steal her? It doesn't add up no matter what people like to say about it. It's just Damon hate at it's finest being repeated without actually looking at all the circumstances surrounding it. Damon was surely conflicted, for one because he loved Elena and he knew he shouldn't and on the one hand wanted so badly to be with her but on the other didn't want to hurt his brother. So of course we were going to see that conflict in his actions. It isn't as simple as you make it sound nor as sinister as 'stealing' his brother's girlfriend. |
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Post by Doppelgänger on Apr 17, 2015 18:10:20 GMT -5
Yeah so she mistreated her childhood friend in favor of a ripper vampire she hardly knew. I always find it funny how everyone acts like Stefan is NOT a ripper who can go off at any time and act like he is a great choice for a boyfriend, perfect, wonderful, nothing at all wrong with him....it makes no sense. But anyway this convo is veering more into anti-Caroline territory by the minute. I used to like the girl but she lost me when she started that crap with Elena. Her friend who got over real fast the fact friend (bonnie)'s mother was killed by Damon. Or all her friends blamed poor matt for Elena been vampire, or tried to take everything Caroline wanted early on. ect.... Elena is not a good friend lol BUT stefan has been to caroline. Honestly I think the reason we all pretend Stefan is not a ripper is a) he controls it more now and b) we like him. It's like we like Damon and excuse the fact he killed Jeremy , Tyler's uncle , Bonnie's mother and way more. We like them so we excuse the bad. Like Klaus. He's a main character on a spin off in which we route for him! He's done horrible things but we like him lol Bonnie or her mother had to be killed. Blame the Originals for that. Stefan could have just as easily been the one to kill her and he was supposed to be but Damon did it to spare him the guilt, once again taking the blame on himself and instead of just outright killing her, he turned her, which was a better deal all around. I don't know how people seem to forget these details and how these things happened.
Nobody pretends that Damon is flawless in the show simply because he has come so far from where he began but Stefan remains blameless for no reason at all with some of those people. He IS a ripper and he does not control it well. He's gone off a couple times now in the span of just a few years. He is dangerous when he is the ripper and that is a part of him whether they want to ignore it or not.
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that's how I saw it to the point i've been saying Caroline is like the one character they always do right IMO she even makes mistake like ****ing klaus in 100th but when Tyler found out she owned up and put the blame on her. Unlike Elena who if she acts bad or messes up its ALWAYS someone else's fault
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